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Our guest Chess Broadnick, a Psychotherapist and Artist, shares his story on how he is trying to point out the interior abstractions of life through his artwork. Chess is a self-taught artist that took 2-years to study and draw self-portraits. He drew from his memories and experiences, pushing his art to the very edge. As a psychotherapist, Chess is exposed to many emotions from his patients. He’s even used his art-making to help his patients when nothing else would reach the severely mentally ill. He shares with us on how art provides connectivity on an emotional level. One thing is for certain, this is an interview that if you think you have heard it all when it comes to creativity, think again. Hear what our guest Chess has to share about the interior abstractions of life. Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 39: Giovanni Lazzaro – Italian Violin Maker In this episode, Giovanni Lazzaro an artisan of string instruments shares what it’s like to be a true craftsman creating perfect performing instruments for the most accomplished musicians. He prides himself in creating instruments that best perform the true “Italian sound”. Working with exotic woods and building a string instrument that not only looks elegant but achieves a heavenly sound that can last for centuries and handed down from one master musician to another.   Show Notes:  Episode 39: Giovanni Lazzaro Italian Violin Maker 00:00:17 – 00:05:03 Every time we schedule an interview with somebody from italy. I wanna move there. Yeah me too. You know rod. We could do our podcast from there. I suppose we could do it there. But you know what you’d have to tear me away from my favorite of all times. Which is italian food. You don’t have to worry about it tonight. Because i am making spaghetti. Of course it’s american style but certainly not what you get an illegal but really good while in a. I really love your spaghetti. I think it’s absolutely wonderful. I actually can’t wait for dinner tonight. But you know what i’ll say like like your barkley. Two pizzas oh good grief. This gone with the show. I’m getting hungry. Do is talk about food. I everyone and here. We are celebrating. What people love to do creatively by giving them a voice. I’m rod jones. i’m angie jones. Welcome to the thought row. Show we invite you to subscribe wherever you listen and you can check us out at thought. Rope podcast dot com where you can also listen to episodes on our website and take a look at the show gust tab and see the actual person that were interviewing of. That’s kind of cool feature and yes we’d love to hear from you. Don’t be shy. You can always reach us through the website contact page and let us know your thoughts. That’s pretty easy to do. Actually super easy now you have to do is type in your message and your email and it comes directly to us. You don’t have to do anything. Fancy and we do everything we can answer them. Yes we do. And then that is why our show is called dot. Ro podcasts up because we want to hear your thoughts speaking thoughts as we always do about this time in our show s how. ’bout your thoughtful quote and you know i think you have to today. I do because. I couldn’t decide on either one so i figured i would just read both of them because they’re really nice. So the first quote is you may have the universe if i may have italy and mattis by giuseppe verde wonderful and the second quote is the creator made italy by designs from michelangelo and this is by mark twain while in. I don’t know that. I would necessarily think that mark twain would come up with that. I have respect from a respect for him. But i know he’s traveled extensively travel in italy quite a bit and i think he brought back his thoughts diz and they ended up in some of his books when he got back to where hannibal missouri a hannibal. Missouri seems like a long way from italy but he was very curious man in like adventure and liked life and equating that his writing style with michelangelo. I think that’s very special. The guy is brilliant and very attuned to life in people. So i think that’s an excellent quote and you’re just simply bertie quote as pretty special to. I thought that was really nice to well. That’s his hometown of his country’s it’s homeland. So yeah but now. It’s your turn rod so we are ready for rods motivational moment. Might be a little anti climatic after those votes. Okay so here it is. Your life’s attitude is nurtured by your daily gratitude. You your life’s attitude is nurtured by your daily gratitude. You know that is the true statement of all. I think in. It’s sometimes it’s hard because you don’t you don’t feel like you wanna be gratitude at all. Well you know when. I was trying to come up with one and i had my pencil and paper kind of fooling around with this and i i started actually think about my attitude and then i also thought that i have an awful lot to be grateful for and then i kind of realized that. If you’re very grateful for the good things that you have in life and we all have at least one thing that really improves attitude. It does it really does. And then also if you just tuned into the gratitude of even if it’s small things you can’t find anything really fantastic talk about that day. ’cause maybe you’re having a bad day but really you can do little things like. Oh i have my favorite gum. I can chew or i have my favorite drink. Have my favorite cup. I mean it can be very small things and then pretty soon you can build into the bigger amounts of gratitude. Like i’m healthy. I have a happy family or a. You know a great car you can fill in the blank with anything. 00:05:03 – 00:10:07 You know what those are all very valuable points. And i think about one time i was on an elevator in new york and there was a guy out there who is i guess he was kind of a comedian but by the time we all got off the elevator we all. I think people actually stayed on that elevator. Could they wanted. They wanted to ride with him all the way to the top or wherever he was headed and he said a lot of really funny loving things and everybody that walked off that elevator car had a big smile on their face and i suspect they probably took that into their offices and i think they were grateful right. Were gratitude re. I think they were very grateful that they had the opportunity to write that elevator to work with a guy who had such a great attitude. Gosh what a talent to get on an elevator and completely change. everybody’s life. Well i think you know both you. And i’ve had those experiences and so yeah it really does. It makes a big difference so show gratitude. It’ll really improve your attitude true. I like this discussion. But i’m gonna change the subject slightly when it comes to creativity and your attitude you know. That’s that’s really kind of important because our show is about creativity right and your attitude. Good or bad definitely has an impact on your productivity in your creativity. You think so true if you if you go in with a bad attitude. I don’t think you’re gonna get too darn inspired because you’re not tuned into anything. You’re tuned in to all the negativity. Well if you’re sitting in front of your piano and you’re trying to compose or even just playing your favorite song to maybe make you feel better. Maybe change your attitude right But you got a really bad tude. You’re mad at the world or whatever the case say b. as very difficult to be creative now. I know there’s people that will argue that. Some great art comes from people that have a really really bad attitude and there certainly is poetry. Come out of people that had a very bad attitude but give me an example of somebody who think as an artist at a bad attitude turned out really great. Works of art Let’s see well. Sylvia plath was not the happiest person on the planet. That’s a great example. Maybe bacon francis bacon. Sure doesn’t the only two. I can think of right off the top of my head. How about you when you think of. That’s why i asked you the credit game. Because i figured you give somebody i would. No i think yourself. Plath was really quite good because every time i read her read her poems or poetry yeah you know he kinda wanna sleet wrists and now. That’s a little harsh bananas stars. But you know she was very emotional person in you know what to say. Well there’s people that really enjoy her work. I don’t know that. I assume composers i. There is a composer. Could say they had that. I can think of that. Had a really bad attitude More often than not and he had a strong justification for beethoven. Oh yeah right. Losing his hearing at that is the most saddest thing i’ve ever heard and everybody thought that he was grouch. Because they’d say something to him and he would just like walk off he would not use the all thought he was a jerk. You know in modern times. They think that he might have had some kind of not asked burgers. But something along those lines where you know he. He had conflict. He was a genius. But i think that maybe had a personality kind of disorder or something along the lines of aspirin her well. It’s difficult for him to be social. And i also think that there’s a classic example of what you equated attitude of gratitude with creativity and he actually is a classic example. I’m glad i thought of it. Because he really. He had every reason to be unhappy and you can imagine what he had gone through. It was brilliant career and he can’t hear his own music anymore. That would give you a really bad attitude too. But it didn’t affect his creativity least. I don’t think it did you know he was that was sent from heaven. I think really you know while we’re on the subject of a good attitude and life although we weren’t exactly talking about a great edzard but we know somebody who has a great attitude in life Let’s bring on our guest okay. So today we’re going to be speaking with jimani lazaro. Who is a his very special talent. He is a violin maker and that by fred’s that is a very creative talent. 00:10:07 – 00:15:01 Yes as many of our listeners know we interview creative people that are passionate about what they do. Today inching are happy to welcome. Giovanni the violin maker yes and on the phone with him will be linda winter. Who’s an artist and the one who introduced as to giovanni lazaro and also linda was on A podcast that we had she was episodes back. So if you’re listening to this you may want to also listen to. Linda in linda has been a driving force in setting up this call and we’ll help with some translation with giovanni because we are not very fluent in italian to say the least are definitely not of fluid to to fat. Were all that fluid in english today. Somedays asked it’s true. Okay so are you guys there. Yeah it’s good to have you here with us today now. Okay before we start our interview. Giovanni we always like to ask our guest. What did you have for breakfast. I had x. michael puts out of that was nice. You buy has a face bricks and what was what did you have i yes. It’s typically alhambra. Plus is laurie milka on some bread and freight law tweaks for it very slow normal. Don’t call different from an american is fresh his night defensively from the american company s.’s. Many years ago and These typical Very easy very is believed warning and estelle. Grisanti home equally War bay your son yards your child’s on and so did you people is well you know what it sounds refreshing refreshing healthy and give you a lot of energy. Yes absolutely some energy to new award to do your best because hired from japanese philosophy. Lofoten every day. You had to do your best simply. Yeah absolutely. i know. I know angie has question for both of you. Actually yeah well. let’s start by asking you. where are you talking to us from right now. Okay we are. We are the absolute of giovanni shock when the way he has system into the crew. She’s wonderful has covered Of audience on the show which in actual practice in secaucus look Bench just tools and this is also the slat where school he accidentally massey which missile area all the gas manzini. Massey was the great men in history. Nice in it’s wonderful. You know there’s an interesting story behind how you to med and led And how you introduced us to giovanni the violin maker. Tell us a little bit about that. Basically i guess i i it’s on tiki fact. And i realized that she went to basically city she halts. It was actually in february march after the looking for kiosk unfazed family odious safe agent. That was open. Won’t city key in. It was allowed. House raised legit cube on the door of the three sets. Up to betsy to back off. 00:15:01 – 00:20:04 Air i i’m weeping friends since and what’s not so long when you get a chance to buy and makers yeah for sure. I remember you telling engine jianye even on a pass conversation. We had prior us. Even doing the podcast with you. You mentioned giovanni and the fact that you purchase that home and actually you’ve made drawings of which are really quite wonderful to look at man that’s Well thank you so much. Thank you for being our podcast and thank you for just see us to giovanni what are you going to say. Well you know this question is for giovanni before we go into the craft and art of making string instruments. Tell us a little bit about your early life. growing up it was my albertina barley. Making clearly was absolutely was like father. Net just eating lunch billick my mother and they just simply asked me. Why don’t you come out to became a major. And obviously i know. Aw walter I didn’t know and they went to my mother was a teacher. He just told me on on the dictionary will does it need and so i wanted to his studio and they opened the dictionary and search for vialli. Is it if you tie we saving. And i found that he’s who makes violence in your lesson tells indigo no. It was the first time in my life that i hardly sam and the icy became kunas. Say why not and so we went to visit the violent. Can schooling brunel was eight. He ranking eighty and we went there with my ma father. We went into these hustle while they would have some school boys. That carving working on the war branches doing some different orcs Appreciate the fluid in love southern when my highest ina anez so somebody was carving a stream things that he’s a scroll is scrawled ball of the channel and saying all is incredible is my is my mother and they save mama i will do it and this is simply the the true story and then That i’m working on is would making me to. It’s really a an interesting story in you. Obviously were meant to do this for a living and think. It’s kind of a blessing that your father made that suggestion to you because it gave you an opportunity to develop a passion for something michael way. Also have a question about that. Because i know you’ve developed a passion for music. Can you tell us a little bit about that. Okay to give up fishing something a goal is comes from people that you have around you or from somebody that key you there by to Input we can say no. I was Since i was young because my father was a logger Music mother will to in my family there was a piano forte today. Now at in front of me here weaknesses. The years when live. And i just thought aviano. I am not players pm okay. My heart is or miming chopin. A the music is good. When you have something you abroad something hands. Maybe we became a painter. So you will pay you sculpture with something. You just came out teachers. How art or you will seek to somebody. But in this case the music easel salute ba-base of everton boss. Music is my bait Might make rhonda from there. Maybe today could be also musicians. Because it was studying in the voting music you baba and they was playing can afford him who food so automated. 00:20:04 – 00:25:14 Think of all walks a could be today. If i couldn’t be an anka’s what could be the shots of my life. Maybe to be a musician. So i’m lucky. Might arentz they wear a buddy smart. She chose or teachers a head. So great patient for catcher. That’s ximenes contour learn. That concert is absolutely necessary. You need because you want to have a beautiful full of meaning you can use it for each one full math. You need to search for catching for beauty absolutely we. We couldn’t agree more with you on that one. And that’s such a state of that so beautifully and the fact that you have that passion for music. That’s just an another part of culture that you’ve been able to embrace that’s really quite wonderful Absolutely yes look we. Don’t use it. I think that we company seemingly no adcose cash. Earliest instrument from our standing has been afloat timorean so music has been in man’s blood ever since the beginning the beginning of what is your question. She s a string instrument maker. giovanni what instruments do you actually make okay. I am specialize in the violence us in challenge. Of course at the beginning i walked on speakers and mandolins said became more focused and specialized in this field. That he’s thirty is a very beautiful team. Happy now violence your us. Intel’s is the main production is my trader. My business and of course they do many things related could these of these to do my clients at of course many services at my law is so four and maybe they have time to make my own each. That would be great. Yeah you know there are many different types of string of cements and you’ve just kind of went over your favorites but could you give us a brief explanation of what each of your favorites. Actually do when it comes to a symphony. His latian beige Yes okay. I love these and have a creek. It feeds doing violence because the they reflected. Humans is also a reasons. Why is lance are be creating at the beginning of season centers nikolay just re i saying the is the chai kay Is incredibly reputed is interesting is that they keep on secession feeling of warmth of beauty and they can move your art they immediately. You are inroads ingrid’s and this is what law about this. Of course any measure a human voice that has about as low as they are. Voice isn’t channel and candy you credible deeply sweet sensation and any anybody. Everybody all of us. We have different than pace that we have different ability in the ol- a nice feeling especially we the these kind of style that kind of sign race and the sole same som- devos you principal to news. We can receive these emotion and each one can keep it and and this is the beauty of music a beautiful ex lexi ashen mealy beauty of and please let me know. 00:25:15 – 00:30:08 Let me say so. He could no did they live. Music is absolutely different from recorded. use me okay. The record the music is incredibly Tools we can say extreme music. A live. Music is sounding. I exceeded that they will likely Everybody goes the concert. Lionel’s lou listen to music live because it is absolutely different completely different. It’s completely different. And we’ve had that experience ourselves effect. I think you we all discuss that. And a pass conversation that what you hear on a lot of people listen to music on their cell phones and there’s nothing like the expression and nothing like the acoustics that you hear in a live performance assistant credible and you also i think pickup the energy from the musicians to you actually see them playing. They give off their own energy. And you can how passionate they are when they’re actually participate in peace. And if it’s a concert then you also have the conductor directing. Everybody says just very exciting all the way around and we agree with you. We highly recommend that anybody that has a chance to go to a concert. Even if it’s just a string quartet it’s well worth the absolutely it is. I remember us Going to a few string quartets when we were in europe. And oh my goodness the sweetness that you heard from the string quartet was does not even measure up to recording and giovanni you live that life to hear that for real all the time. Yeah so very cool. Well you know it seems to me that making a string instrument is craft that requires not only skill but a tremendous amount of patience and dedication. Tell us how you approach your work every day. Okay my okay i i. I think the dan very much did they ever be credible job. Java consid- job is a patient more than we need money to leave. We need to read in to pay the billings to buy a car up for me. I will do it. We got to get mommy bud. We can okay. This is a normal. I’m lucky today. F. piece job but every morning when they get up i i think today i will be eliminated a relieved somebody some musicians. Some clients ran the body. That will give me new emotion so will pushy to do something you to express a new concepts or toolmaking you usually or to get getting i motion. So this is why i’m lucky. And every day is a very also hard walk of course is not easy. You nominate to get the best. You always have to vessel energies. And this is not easy is hard but when new settlers Everyday wait a moss and ears. You build up. You became more comfortable with work. You will you improve your and you meet people to get permission you as seen help you to enjoy. Who inspired life. I really liked what you said. Yeah he is very inspirational. You said and i know you probably meet a lot of people that get excited just to visit your shop to see what goes on. Yeah i attached you this question because we know there’s a lot of commercially made instruments out there. The ones that are mass produced and a handcrafted instruments such as the ones you skillfully make would is the big difference there. Okay believe me is not so hard is not so hard to make everybody can make week. Sons keel says some cleaver across k. So the difference mainly for between a factory each day holiday each is that in the hameed. 00:30:08 – 00:35:07 Is you have to prove your own so it became your inches. Your only young There’s only one each like yours is a unique action and your sound is your son window. Factory instruments respect. Was you know that are so many people that you want to learn to lay out in they can afford immediately the biggest stance okay so they introduce many people to the violence but when you became Violence usually is like a wave. Drive a car at the beginning. You need A good car. Siebel bull cheap not expensive because you need to practice driving but when you became a for example you are sir gooding bryden that you became a drive for fresh on driverless. Us for you need us car and you want to ways. Because you need the occult racecar. Saw busy management is like racecar is a like a like a as expensive car where you need to dominate car. You know how to use it and the car is super powerful. You must know how to to kick in your hand. He’s the sad for violent. I really nice violin. He knew a race. These explanation is perfect under is excellent eleven in. I love having a race car in your hand because it really is like that you get that same exhilaration in the same on feedback in the fr- same freedom that you can feel by going very fast right. Yeah yeah okay. So giovanni string instruments are primarily crafted out of wood. Is there a special source for the would that you use in your finally crafted instruments that you make okay. I’m these sole each material enrollment here my best. And then you in woods for example the mako From the north of pekan and because e the day italian maple is facilitated based on the wall has son taking cold. choose at our Some they may will is mainly used for the bag reeves schools. Each is coming from balkan outlet savion is gonna golfing on ex-yugoslavia. It’s a debt. Maple is absolutely the best. We are speaking both for the beauty city beauty but the would mainly discuss And when you find the right the makiya. I saw or many years now for making insolence. Using would that they both my father and my goodness longtime ago walked is my salk and when a might today owner will use Leeson before ten picky use okay and if you want to make way east you can use a chip beck coming. Begged the race cow. If you will use you sure sir is you will never be dangerous. You need the best absolutely the best because the cheer we you’re experienced a your skills you can understand how these murcia just touchy just watching hollywood sound and then you will create a since the beginning. Your project is based on monday book that you have anew hands you say okay. He’s from. He’s kind of song and then i will use for this kind of or nam is bad for the other candidates these the persona is give deeper song more anger call. 00:35:08 – 00:40:01 No this. is we really give a sylmar volley any will be right or another kind of and we now these knowledge you can insider yourself on me. You know that is very interesting. And i don’t think we ever really appreciate the would what it means to have the quality would as well as the seasoned would. Obviously you season. You’re would it you keep it for a long time so even the wood itself Matures in its resonance we know from earlier conversations with you that every string instrument that you make has its own unique characteristics and personality. Could you share with us. What that means because power to the who say Are so complex is Fox is so you have in front few musician Did not by what you have a product. Hugh great play. These great has as his own pace. When you make it each month you have to. He stays end the into independent premium of your of you. So they instruments became a perfect weeks of the request of speed client. And your face you mix together and then you estimate stopping that. He a rated support musician. -sition in red flag cheese while assan es and this is the most beautiful aspect of my war when a saab in this. Speak with mike. I end what we have to do while where we want to apply what should be in play. Walsh how should way. And the so the emory instrument is like a first for me. I could see that lead. That easily is like a purse like us anthony. He has his own identity as on route. Three six and is loop. That’s that’s a it’s a really good explanation and it really explanation. And i i understand from what you just said that you work very closely with the musician. Once you start crafting it and you have to really understand and listen his music cow. He’s plays his style of playing. And then you have to design the instrument to fit for. Not only i guess you have to also make sure it fits him physically that he can hold properly. Yes yes you’re right you a alan you colleagues is. The real. Violent action is working tied context. We the your your friend because you can friend. I’m sure for many years your work on his army all on insurance and then he could make a commission to you for new instruments. Dad this is the moment you put all your yourself is he wants you and we ask divinely manian. And when he statement For me you have a big big challenge and big Because you had to give the right awesome. So is why i lock. Yeah goes eight. Put yourself in that situation if they have to my best. Guess angeleri canoe. You have a follow up to that. That talked about you guys. Yeah we just talked about that and also just listening to the sound of someone. Playing one of your instruments is simply beautiful. And i can tell you that when you we win. Linda had sent over recording. And we listen to it on our computer even that listening to it just on the speakers of the computer it was so beautiful and it must be so gratifying for you to hear someone play an instrument that you have designed and crafted. How do you feel when you hear of virtuoso playing one of your instruments. Could question question really. Beautiful me yeah. Cpap you’re considered that when you listen. You instrument blame. 00:40:02 – 00:45:03 The hands of greg plays or simply. Is your view new museum. Play on your instrument. You’re simply be washing his want. You feel when i when i see unleash landed. They made in the comeback. Here or check is like to see a picture of me mutual and years ago i see myself because nice my myself is all. It was fun and today different and emotion it. They say i can’t explain on is simply not keeping law and your head. I worked for this to listen nutrition way. Well it must be very rewarding for a talented musician to have the opportunity to play when you’re instruments that you’ve handcrafted or better yet to own one. What are these musicians like marriages. I’d love to know where mencia who are like. I don’t wanna say who are they. What are they like. And obviously you’ve become lifelong friends with some of them. I suspect we became friends. I have a different clients. You also producing eight produce to East of here no more. I okay. Eighty made almost one hundred ninety twins. Production you became a friend because when you have a great musician under san law what you do and this is not Everybody loss loss looking not help that you need the right. We have the right feeling. And then you come. You share the same as the same funded fuel. Also the live. Show the same feeling. Our lives became friend. They really great musicians that earned my friends at the final we’ve seasonally because we may fell away and simply because they they decide to order mental and simply because we share two years us following the is new england was a long process and we shared a years of all the call it warranty. I can imagine it must be very exciting for them as a musician also witnessed the process. And i’m sure the day that they finally take possession of the instrument that you’ve made that probably is very happy and proud day for them. You know as you’re an artist. Okay for sure. Your artist or craftsman. I think everybody would like to know how you sign your instrument. How’d you sign when that ukraine. How if i were to pick up one. How would i know it was crafted by giovanni in basically every made by the makings eastern putting side eastman label my label. These lonzo autumn lazzaro made these these ninety five rates. And and then i my senior in especially is seen so mustrom years. Every instrument has his own name name. Sircar won’t be is medina is lena. We have the different kind of needs are being given who these. Because the the name of these moments reflect mean of your vinca client can reflect shocking. That mitch you declined for a while the losses the Remaining this francis ryan’s was a katrina at the arena. His name this beautiful. His name at didn’t because she say june his friend had release some travels. 00:45:03 – 00:50:07 It is not easy and was so what about these solitaire and the airport in lucky. That was fine. The end saw. I suddenly we get with the site name Lena nice for amy’s the really incredible. I’m sure it makes it very special for him. You know i have to. I want to ask this question. When get into a too deep of a discussion but both engine. I know that laura laura could you share a little bit about who she is and what an her support has meant to you. Apparently she’s a very keen fan of yours. She’s my she’s my law necessarily your superfan. Then my my my aloe my is is. We ain’t now useful now and she’s Girl that eight years ago she was vice. That makes sense. You make france human loss okay and She was in mine. She was an incredible and she seal my arm because was always la. She give me a on the view. That is a really accessible. She looked at me. She watch for the and she always saw the warning. You’re making a mistake. No you’re doing work non today are we have to change. You have to so so lucky that she saw clearer to smart. Give me always he. So deeply law suits almost such and that she doesn’t save me on your why you’re wrong. You’re doing well. You must’ve better and these lucy always to change to radio to have new energy to inside a. She wasn’t incredible. Kind of hannity. I can imagine you know you. And i have something greatly something in common. Because energy is the same way for me as laura is for you. I can’t tell you how many times that she’s redirected me a redirected my thinking or said. Hey you know what you could do this a little bit differently and probably would be better so bravo you know to your to your bride. What a lovely lady. But the atkin understand where laura is coming from no because when you care for someone in you understand them on multiple levels their soul their creativity and what their passion is life you want you wanna be contributing to that in you have a real connection so i can completely understand where she’s coming while the fact that she played violin right there. So there’s some absolutely mechanic my steady wooded Incredible for me to after many ist. I was okay at a life before. Okay another song. He’s twenty one. Years old is sudden. Recipe is rainfall. My for some okay. I have a lot evens. And but when i saw a lot went inside or work filing and i simply went in front of the white sauce. Amish mace believe all kill hand as we all every and i suppose to national agencies to the atmosphere between electric. Oh i can imagine. And she’s with margaret be strong body odor described sentences. Taika i she she has to strike the taika and she just a central driving force the it sounds like it sounds loving. 00:50:07 – 00:55:04 I’m gonna ask you giovanni a question that we ask. Everybody is sometimes. It could be a tough one but everybody wants to an answer to this for sure in five words or less. What would you tell people that. Want to live more creatively and if you have to use more five words it’s it’s uh i you well you you kind of addressed it in a lot of the things that you said but if you’re going to give advice to maybe even a young violin maker what would you tell them just to enjoy first of all you to enjoy who expressed to be ready to to be hard to full harvey your your hauling. If you you you must exploit your talent but colin this knocking never you. Must you must work and you time you need a lot of time. Because today i have depression that may make people safe that to get top is easy you can arrive in southern lead to the sauces. You get subsidies many reach by quickly. This is not true. My experience it’s armagh and only few people can and these need holland application. The jeez and a lot of mistakes to earn a new. You know he. In some. I i lead to some moments where a disciple leaf. Who more saw you can. You must love it you trust. See that’s that’s like the perfect explanation of enjoy your life ambig- success go with what you’re doing you calculus. You can’t give up. You may feel days like you absolutely do not to do it. Yes but sooner or later the the but then the next morning you get up in your refreshed in. You’re like okay. i can do this. Yeah i can do this. I like it okay. So now we’re going to ask you giovanni question we’ve been asking all of our guests and their answers are so interesting and that is if you can sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past. Who would it be awesome. Many i up and domino truck one off. The grid is followed like to see in the city. Police speaking about the soul or magog bizarre is my band as my loss is up. Certain account money known simply because he’s music case so when they met his music. Say okay. I can leave anymore without news. And a how can sukey roy. That’s a great question. That’s can you be such a gene if we ever if we ever get mozart as again asking. We’ll ask that for you is incredible is live and see a very short short free years ago now and people go to became a dangerous and then painted only for almost ten years of the raid. Trae aged almost thirty years when he campaigns. Okay he was. I really would like to speak within to ask you. How do you see so you are being able to see in front of you. One hundred years in two hundred years instrument and the on golden never sold. No what is hard as leo. Who tried he. You have to think that these great talented people especially the ones that passed away so young. Were divinely inspired That was their mission on this planet. I guess and that was it to bring joy joy beauty creativity inspiration like violence violence. 00:55:05 – 00:57:55 Hope my mommy’s will posse. They will follow the way. And i moved night because the diet one eight. It’s relaxing one day. We will for sure we will die back. Think that south we will remain neutral for sure absolutely it will J- giovanni linda part on this this conversation because it very very interesting On actually making a beautiful instrument that has been a major contributor to classical music as well as other forms of music both engine. I thank you so much for giving us and our listeners. An opportunity to know a little bit about how it’s done. You are so generous with your thoughts and your ideas and your passion. I think that really came through. Yes it did and your creativity and craftsmanship is such an inspiration. And i think our listeners are really going to enjoy this episode because so much insight and and into such creating and creative passion right now. Life and also. I need to let everyone know if you’d like to know more about giovanni we will have links for him under the show guest tab on bought row podcast dot com so everyone can learn more about him and please connect with him on social media and his website. Yet please do you. This is a real treat. We’re very fortunate to have him as guest in linda. We really appreciate you making this happen. I know we had talked about it off and on now for several months. So thank you guys so much. Acid it was up to on them. Lucky that i have been a friend has definitely maybe thank you to you. You are being so To kind to didn’t cake to Impatient me and i had a big to lena for. Hold these rate shots. Oh well we appreciate both of you very much and so it’s goodbye for now. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas we shared with you. We post a new podcast every week. So remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. So you don’t miss an episode. So it’s by for now from my husband rod an eye wishing everyone a great day   Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 38: Monica L. Smith – Piecing Life Through Fragments Want to know what it’s really like to be an archaeologist? Our guest Monica L. Smith is an archaeologist and author. Monica provides us with an in-depth look at archaeology. Its impact on civilizations past and present. Plus, what it’s like to live life as an archeologist. She teaches archeology and has written numerous books on the subject. Discover what it means to piece life through its many fragments – past and present.   Show Notes: Episode 38: Monica L. Smith Piecing Life Through Fragments 00:00:15 – 00:05:01 I noticed you were messing with my grocery list again this morning. What do you mean? You know all the bizarre things that you add to my list. Oh yeah, like kangaroo milk or sea cucumbers my favorite I wish you’d pick some up. Yeah, like those. Well, at least you kept it G rated at this time. Well, you know what? I fancy myself as a brilliant writer and you’re shopping lists is one of my favorite writing exercises. Really? I thought you were being flirty. Well, I suppose in my own way, I am. Hi, everyone, and here we are, celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice I’m rod Jones. And I’m in G Jones. Welcome to the thought row podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen, and you can also go to our website at thought rope podcast dot com and listen there directly. Yeah, that’s a good idea. Yes, we would love to hear from you. And don’t be shy, you can always go there. We have a contact page on our website, so you can share with us your thoughts and maybe your questions. Yes, and we would love to hear from you. That is why our show is called podcasts. So we want to hear your thoughts. Yes. Thought provoking thoughts, which reminds me how about your thoughtful quote. Okay. Oh, my quote for this week is or this episode is archeology is the peeping Tom of the sciences. It is the sandbox of men who care not where they are going. They merely want to know where everyone else has been. And that is by Jim bishop. You know, for some reason, I suspected your quote would have something to do with archeology, seeing how our guest is going to be. Yeah, I’m so excited about her and I wanted to be in concert with what we’re doing a little later on in the interview. Well, you know what I really like that quote, I think you found a really good one. And you know, it’s not only about digging in the sand, although I personally like to do that, I think it has to do with urban archeology. Yeah. Or everything that we discover no matter where we are, what we’re doing. I guess it really gets down to seeing hearing and feeling. It absolutely is. And, you know, in the times that we found different things, it’s always fascinating to see different people’s lives and I can’t imagine digging up something from ancient Egypt or Byzantine period or something like that. Well, the two is crafting the story that goes with it. Yeah. If you’re standing there and you have a bunch of things that you found, even if it’s something you found in an old abandoned home and you pick up different I’ll call them relics. They are relics of these different relics in you hold them up in your hand and you look at them and you go, I wonder what the family did with this. And it could be a broken teacup, and then you start going, you start telling yourself a story, but we’ll maybe this tea cup was an heirloom and it was handed down by the great great grandmother and then all of a sudden it’s broken into a bunch of pieces. I know. Kind of sad. It’s a little sad. Okay. That’s a story. It is, it is. But now it’s going to be your turn rod and we’re ready for your rods motivational moment. Well, I know how motivational this is going to be, but this is something that I’ve been thinking about. It has something to do a little bit with archeologists. We are archeology. We all have histories both good and bad trapped within our minds. Some are best left deeply buried and others should be brought to the surface and celebrated. Well, I guess that’s what makes you the rich vibrant person that you are. When you have all of these experiences, the good and the bad. Well, I equate that to again a little bit of it has to do with how you feel about yourself and how important it is to maintain a good positive outlook about yourself. And if you bring up negative thoughts, they don’t necessarily make you feel good about yourself. In fact, they could be downright destructive, not to get into any kind of real psychology here. Because I certainly am not one. Right. But good thoughts are much better than bad thoughts. 00:05:01 – 00:10:25 Right. And then everyone is having a human experience and not everything is going to be perfect all the time, but you I guess you apply it to where the negative experiences, what is it teaching you? Well, that’s good. So you’re not just dwelling in the crap. No, you know what? That’s a very good point because these are all lessons in life. And we may not like some of them, but interestingly enough, when you look back in retrospect, you often say, boy, I don’t want to do that again, but I sure learned a lot from it. Yeah. And it’s really funny when I know this is probably true for you and it definitely is true for me. Some of the most trying times you learn the most , even though they really suck a lot. Yeah. Yeah, they could be pretty crummy. Then I think you kind of have to avoid people and maybe the news which can also bring on stress and anxiety. You don’t need that in your life. There’s not much you can do about it. So getting back to that last thing I said in my little quote thing is bring forth the good things and celebrate them. Right. Exactly and put the energy out there of celebrating. You bet. And then also, I think it’s about discovery when you think about it and what it means for creativity, you know? Well, creativity, any form of creativity is all about discovery. You know, you may be sitting at a piano and found out what three, three notes. Four nodes. Four now. Four notes. Four notes, which turned out to be the most famous symphony ever. Absolutely. And you had to consider the fact that Beethoven was sitting in front of his keyboard, and he clinked a couple notes out and all of a sudden look what he ended up with. But it’s also in photography. Yeah. I think photography is another thing that a person could do that really causes you to focus and when you’re looking on your phone or you’ve got a camera and you’re looking through the eyepiece. All of a sudden, all the distractions that are all around you just seem to disappear. They should be disappearing even if you’re taking a picture of a loved one. You’re trying to focus on them. And of course, you’re always trying to get the good expression from them, but all the garbage all this stuff that’s going on around them and around you just seems to disappear and it’s just kind of a one on one thing. But that’s discovery, and that’s creative discovery. So true. What were you gonna say about photography you had something interesting to say? Oh, yeah, you know, I noticed that when you photograph fraud, it’s so interesting because you pay attention to so many different things in detail and it’s amazing but lighting, the composition, the subject, but also making an interesting story. I mean, I see many people that do one of the other or a couple of things. But when you truly can bring all of those elements together, but plus bring emotion to that photo in that little tiny rectangle, that is really where you shine as an artist. As you know, that’s one of my was a commercial guitar for many years. But the thing out there is a couple of things that irritate me when I look at other people’s photographs. And that is if they take a beautiful portrait of somebody and then there’s a post behind them coming right out of their head, or they take a beautiful sunset and they don’t have the horizon strait, makes me think that the ocean is going to pour off the edge of the earth because the horizon is not straight, but yeah and seeing in any form of creativity no matter what you do, is critically important. So true, but while we’re on the subject of discovery, let’s bring on our guest. Okay, so today we’re going to be speaking with Monica L Smith and she’s an archeologist and I can’t wait for her to be excited about this episode. Monica, welcome to the thought rob podcast. I know both the MG and I have been really excited to have an archeologist as a guest. I think we both know that that is a very unique area of creativity. Yes, hi, Monica. It’s so good to have you with us today. And this promises to be a very interesting discussion. And I am very excited to hear what you have to say. So thank you very much for having me. And thank you for welcoming me into your beautiful creative community. Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. Well, you’re going to be a great guest for us. I think so. And our listeners, of course. Absolutely. And then before we officially start our interview, we always like to ask our guests, what did you have for breakfast this morning, Monica? So today, you know, this is the time of the year when I like to have what I call a Turkish breakfast, which is pita bread and honey and walnuts and dried apricots and olives and sometimes some cheese, if I’ve got the right kind of cheese around. 00:10:26 – 00:15:01 And some black tea with sugar and I like to take that outside on the balcony of our little apartment. And I sort of pretend that I’m a couple of blocks away from the Bosporus and it’s hot outside. So it feels like Istanbul. And that’s my Turkish breakfast. That sounds perfect. And that’s exactly a Turkish breath. So breakfast, so good for you. Well, you can relate. Yeah, and on the Bosporus. Yeah, absolutely. Good for you. What a lovely breakfast. I know. I think we made copy it. We do sometimes. I would definitely like to copy. Yeah. Well, moving on, archeology is an interesting field of research and science. When you were growing up, was this a profession Monica that you thought you would ever pursue? So many people if I meet them on a bus or an airplane will say, oh my gosh, I always wanted to be an archeologist when I was a kid. It’s very exciting. You must dig up dinosaurs. I saw this thing on TV and so on and so forth. So what’s interesting is that I was not that person. I was not that kid that grew up and thought they always wanted to be an archeologist. I actually came into archeology from a long and circuitous route through a number of other things. I actually started out as an English major. I was going to study European literature and English literature of the renaissance period. I started taking Latin because that was, of course, the lingua franca. And then I gradually sort of migrated into doing classical civilizations, Latin, and ancient Greek. And then it was only after I had started graduate school where I had gone to do a master’s degree in latins. Talk about a very obscure career path. An interesting one, though, I might say. Yeah. Absolutely, absolutely. And so I started taking some archeology courses because pretty soon I realized that I was not going to be the kind of person who could sit around and read a dead language all day. I wanted to do something much more active and then as I started taking more archeology courses and then doing some fieldwork, I eventually completely went in that direction towards field archeology and doing digs and surveys and traveling and so that was the evolution of me becoming an archeologist. Man, are you glad you did? Oh, absolutely. I have the best job in the world. I think that if I were not an archeologist, my second career towards would have been pilot. And I do, I do think about that sometimes that I would have loved to have been a pilot. I actually took for my PhD exams when I passed my PhD exam. My husband gave me a flight lesson as a present. So nice. And that is an amazing feeling to be going down the runway and you pull back you’re in the air. And that I would have loved to do. That is not necessarily compatible with being an archeologist because I don’t know. You can fire some too locations. I don’t know. The next question I wanted to say that they discovered archeological sites from the air. What are those lascaux? The drawings that you see in the earth from the air? You can only see them from the air. That’s it. Right, right. And in fact, we’re very indebted to people who fly and photograph archeological sites because this is something that people have been doing since the 1920s. And many of those aerial photographs record landscapes that are no longer present. People have built over them. People have farmed over them. So, yes, archeology from the air, archeology underwater, archeology under the microscope. There are so many ways that we use the power of vision to be able to talk about the past. But the thing about being a pilot is that if you’re going to be serious, you have to do it very regularly. You really have to fly all the time. I mean, it’s not, it’s not like other hobbies where if you don’t do it for 6 months or a year, it doesn’t affect your skills that much, but you know, if you’re going to be up there in a machine, you definitely want to make sure that you have good practice. So I reconciled myself to the fact that I was not going to be a pilot. 00:15:01 – 00:20:02 I was going to be an archeologist. And I’m glad about that. Every single day. Oh, I can imagine, but personally, I’m so glad that pilots do practice every day. They need to. Okay, so my question is, where are you originally from and tell us a little bit about your background? So I’m originally from California and I live in Los Angeles now. So I’m back in my ancestral homeland, which I very much appreciate. And one of the things that really marked my childhood was that I was able to do a little traveling, which when people hear that, they think like, oh, my goodness, that’s so nice. It’s a bit of privilege and so on. But the catch is that all of my family was in France. My mother came to the United States as a young bride and so we really didn’t have any family here in the U.S. and it was only when I was about 9 years old and we went to France for the first time that I had a chance to meet my grandmother and my cousins. And other people of my family. And so I really think of my time in France as a kid was not about being in an exotic foreign local. It was about being the family and that really had a profound effect on me. And maybe that was where the seeds of archeology began. Definitely. The history that’s there. Absolutely. In France and other parts of Europe, I was able to travel around and go to Italy because my family was very close to the Italian border. And there, the past is just part of the natural fabric of the village and the town of the city. You see churches that are hundreds of years old. You walk down the street and they’re excavating some Roman ruins that are 2000 years old. And so the past is not a foreign concept or an unfamiliar concept. The past is just completely part of everyday life in a way that is not quite the same in a place like Los Angeles. No, I mean. In many cases even more history that they can dig up. It’s pretty incredible. Yeah. You know, you touched on this briefly, but I would like to know we would like to know what you specifically do as an archeologist, what you do. So I’m a university faculty member. So I teach courses and I also do field work. Most of my field work is in India with my Indian colleagues and many, many wonderful Indian students from different Indian university who have come to work with us. And of course, in pre COVID times, I was going to India quite frequently for research projects that involved excavations. They involve survey, they involve archival work, they involve many teams of people who were part of our research enterprise. And even though we’re not going to the field now, we certainly have many things that we’re doing with the data. So in many countries now, all of the physical materials you know the things we dig up are kept in local museums and repositories. And we’d bring back data. We bring back photographs, we bring back spreadsheets, we bring back measurements. And so that’s what I also spend a lot of my time doing here. Do you share that with your students then? Yes, absolutely. So I’m working with some graduate students and some undergraduate students who are doing their own research projects with some of the information. So for example, I’m working with one graduate student who is looking at the animal bones from the research projects that we’ve done. And is doing PhD dissertation on that. I’ve worked with other students who have looked at other components like different kinds of pottery designs, different kinds of ornamentation. So really, an archeological project becomes a springboard for many other people to have some information that they could use for their own ideas and projects. Very interesting. It was very interesting. So how does a person learn to become an archeologist? Well, I’m going to tell you that there’s no great secret about being an archeologist. It’s really about powers of observation. And many times you’ll have people come and volunteer on archeological projects. Now I’ve found that the best archeologists are really people like librarians and dentists. Why? Because they’re really good at making observations, and they’re really good at writing things down when they see something. So that’s really all it takes to be an archeologist is good powers of observation. The analogy of the dentist makes a lot of sense. Does that make sense? They’re very good at documenting. 00:20:03 – 00:25:00 And they’re very good at detailing things. Exactly. Exactly. So I’m going to turn you into an archeologist right now. Next time you walk down your street, start looking at things like just sidewalk, start looking at things like, you know, the little cuts in the street start looking at things like bolts on the sidewalk in front of the coffee shops. Look at little scars on the wall and then you realize the scar used to belong to a phone booth. It was attached to the wall. But we don’t have those anymore. And the bolt in the sidewalk used to belong to a newspaper box, but we don’t have those anymore. And the crack in the sidewalk is because, you know, there were some repairs that were undertaken there that they had to cut the sidewalk. Once you start looking for all those things, you’re going to read your neighborhood like archeological book. That’s interesting. What we often see because of where we live when we walk down a road, we say gouges and the pavement that the snow plow left last winter. Yes. Exactly. And a batch of feathers on the side of the road because somebody had their lunch. Yeah, they’re lunch, yeah. Because we live in the mountains. So there’s a lot of interesting, more rural aspects of, I guess archeology as well. But I’d like, I like your I love them. The foundation is so true. And so many people at this day and age don’t even remember that there were phones everywhere. No, they don’t. You have to watch an old movie to see somebody call up somebody in a phone booth and they go, why are they doing that? Yeah. Yeah. I have to ask you this question. You might be a little frivolous, but I want to ask it anyway. You know, there’s been some really famous popular movies about archeologists and archeology. Do you think that those movies have had an influence on people wanting to pursue a career in archeology? I think that’s definitely true. Of course, that’s true of any profession. You know, every time they come out with a new CSI, we have a bumper crop of students who want to become forensic analysts. And so having something in the popular media is certainly something that awakens people’s imaginations to possibilities and to creativities. So, yes, although Indiana Jones was not an ethical or careful archeologist. You’ll still find that, you know, posters of Raiders of the Lost Ark are hung on the graduate archeology labs of the world . Really, that’s interesting. Well, he made it cool. He did make a cool. Even though he probably wasn’t the best archeologist ever. Because I’m sure he wasn’t very careful. Monica said the ethical aspect. But he had a cool hat. Yeah. That’s true. So everybody, all the archeologists probably had to go out and buy a hat like that. Although I’m sure you cover your head when you’re out there on a date. Yeah, I would think so. Yes, archeology is a hat wearing profession. You know, and that’s something that often surprises people about archeology too. And there are many things that you don’t see on TV history channel, Discovery Channel, and so on. You don’t see people sitting in a lab day after day, sorting out, you know, little pieces of rock from little pieces of bone. You don’t see people who’ve been trudging across the landscape with a 15 pound backpack, full of metal stakes to stake outsides and then map the is a lot of difficult, heavy work sometimes that is not necessarily the glamorous part that you see on television. And probably not the weather conditions are probably not all that one. That’s what I was going to say. How do you tolerate the heat? Because India is very warm. In humid, how do you tolerate the heat Monica when you’re there? So I would say that it’s something that you get used to because it is just part of the environment. So I’ll tell you about a summer that I had once three very hot experiences. I did a summer field season in India just before the monsoon because I wanted to see what the weather conditions would have been like other than the nice times of year when we generally go and do field work. And that was really instructive because by about 9 o’clock in the morning, you did not see any living creature on the landscape, except for the archeologists. I think there’s no dog, no person, no cow, nothing. Just us out there. And that gave me a much better appreciation for what it was that ancient people went through to create their sites and to farm their land. And then second experience that same summer, I was very close to DRB cure in southern Turkey. 00:25:01 – 00:30:07 And it was suffocatingly hot. It was very, very difficult. The project director there said that any decision that you make after about ten o’clock in the morning is probably not a good decision. And then the third hot experience was in the American Southwest. And that was sort of my extra long summer archeology. And they were all unbelievably hot in their own way. But it was a great learning experience. And I guess I just tolerate heat more than other people. Please don’t ask me to go work in the Arctic. I don’t think that would be a great idea. Exactly. My goodness. That’s good for you. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I know when we had our initial conversation with you Monica, you shared with us the concept of piecing from fragments. Could you elaborate on this philosophy of yours? So one of the things I appreciate about the creative community that you have here is that you have many people who are artists or writers or painters or welders, and people who work with the earth, people who work with plants. And all of us are working with little pieces of things. Especially in archeology, we rarely find anything that is complete. We find broken pieces of pottery that somebody long ago through a way. We find broken pieces of buildings that have deteriorated since the time that they were actually lived in. And as archeologists, that’s our palate. That’s what we’re trying to work with in order to be able to understand a whole life in the past or a whole site in the past. We’ve just got these little fragments. Now, if you transfer that into thinking about the ways that we all work with fragments today, regardless of our creative professions, we never have a complete anything, do we? I mean, if we’re working with making ceramics if we’re working with making paintings if we’re working with making poetry if we’re working with making music, we start with like a little fragment. You know like a little fragment of a tune or a little doodle. And we eventually craft that into a whole story. It’s so true. It’s exactly true. I think we do that in our personal lives as well as our creative lives every second of the day, really, because we’re going on the breadcrumbs and the fragments of maybe knowledge that we’re seeking for the day. Yeah, and thank you, Monica for sharing that philosophy. Because our listeners, as you know, as you pointed out most are very creative people they think creatively. But I don’t think any one of them have ever thought about it from that perspective. That’s an interesting perspective you just shared. Everything is fragmentary. Everything is created from experience. And even people that you know really well friends that you’ve had for years or your significant other, your partner, your work colleagues. They’re always likely to come out with something that you didn’t know. So there’s some other fragment that all of a sudden explains something that you had never quite realized before. So it’s not just about physical stuff that’s fragments, but it’s also about ideas and perspectives and emotions and things that people share with you. No wonderful. It’s so wonderful. So that makes me want to ask, how does archeological research inform your daily life and vice versa? So for one thing, whenever I break something, it’s not so bad. It’s true. I get a chance to see. It’s, you know, it’s inside. And how it was made. And, you know, being an archeologist is about picking up other pieces of broken things from other people’s lives. And, you know, when I’m making garbage, I’m just passing that along in the archeological record for the future. So that’s about the little, you know, the little things that happened. I think that also it gives me a pretty long perspective on human behavior and human activities. There is certainly many things about human behavior that are sub optimal. But those behaviors have been around for a long time. And also positive human behaviors. You know, the ability to decorate things that don’t require decoration is something that goes back very far in human history. And I think that that’s a very hopeful sign. You know, if you break a figurine, it’s natural that somebody will pick it up and with their delicate hands and fingers they’ll sit there and try to piece it back together, but that is like you mentioned earlier, they have to have a keen sense of observation to see where this piece might fit to that piece. 00:30:08 – 00:35:02 They may be heartbroken because it may be something that was really a favorite of theirs. But they’re piecing it back together. Yeah. I think we all like to do that, is that true? Absolutely. You know, whenever we encounter something that we think of as broken, whether it’s an object or a relationship, we think about how it might be made whole again. We probably should ask whether or not we should bother. Very true. And in the end, you know, what you have are the memories of that object or that relationship with that person that are the ways that you put together a fragmentary set of impressions for yourself. That’s good. That’s very interesting. Yeah. Now we often see archeologists out in the field doing research and basically digging up history. What is the reality of working as a team in these various sites? One of the reasons that I became an archeologist and that archeology was very attractive to me is that it is a team pursuit. You know where I was being a historian or other kinds of fields are really a person working in an archive alone, but you can’t do archeology by yourself, which is important. You need people who are on a team. And, you know, I’d like to talk about somebody who was in a very important mentor to me, a man named bob powers from the National Park Service. And I worked for him for several seasons on an archeological survey project that had a whole bunch of different kinds of people on it. There were retirees that were professional archeologists. There were students. There were people who ended up going into very different careers. And he was very skilled at bringing people together into a team where everybody’s best capacities could be made to integrate with other people’s skills. And that’s also what I’ve tried to do in the archeological teams that I’ve had the privilege of being able to direct and co direct. And you know, that’s a really great feeling when you have people who come into a teamwork situation who maybe are not experienced, but they get the opportunity in a supportive environment to try something new and be successful. That is the best part of archeology. It’s not what we find or the weather or what we’ve been able to surmount. It’s the feelings of the people who have been working together. And it’s kind of this unique moment in time, right? Any particular archeological season has a group of people who will never be in that exact same configuration ever again. But we carry those memories forward in a really wonderful way. I would think so, you have like minds and you’re all moving towards a common goal. True. You’re working as a team. And you’ll never be there again. I mean, in that same capacity and moment. So it’s kind of a cool creative way to really express creativity amongst a team. And I’m sure great friendships probably percolating. Oh, yeah. Very much so. We often think of archeologists as camping at least as how I think of it. Camping out in some remote desert areas 15 through sand and soil and maybe broken shards of pottery, but it’s our understanding that there’s such a thing as urban archeology. Could you give us your thoughts on that? So many of the world’s great cities are in locations that are perfect for trade or economics. And so when we think of cities like London, New York and Mexico City, Paris, many other global cities, are located in places where guess what? Ancient people thought that was a great place, too. And as a result, there are many global cities where every time they dig a trench for a new sewer pipe or a new waterline or a new fiber optic cable or a new subway tunnel, they are running into archeological remains. And so for example, there is in London a crack archeological team that is deputized to go to places where they’re building new buildings or building subways in New York City and downtown right on Wall Street, you can see that there are some old archeological remains underfoot they’ve put glass over it. So you can see it under Notre-Dame in Paris. You can see the remains of the gala room in city. The big dig in Boston was all about going through the many layers. 00:35:02 – 00:40:10 Urban life that happened before. So urban archeology is absolutely something that is part of our archeological repertoire. Usually, however, instead of like that Indiana Jones, people are wearing a hard hat and they’re surrounded by bulldozers because it’s a pretty noisy undertaking. So true. Now you’ve said in your writings that archeology is an is not about old things, but it’s a way of understanding materially, the way in which people engage with objects in space, what are some of the things around us that give us an archeological perspective in our lives today? So one of the things that’s interesting about human beings is that we have a lot of stuff, don’t we? We all agree to that one. Yes, and I think most people, you know, we would be lucky to say that we have too much stuff. But all those things we bring into our houses on purpose. Nobody is coming to our House and delivering things that we don’t want. And as a result, everything about our lives is encoded in our special occasion clothing and our everyday coffee mug and the layout of our living rooms to be welcoming to people who come into our spaces. So we make these very deliberate choices about our objects and our spaces. And that is another way of being archeological. You know, like, when you go into somebody’s house, you can tell what’s important to them by what’s displayed, you know, if you catch a look in their kitchen drawer, you can see the kinds of things that they use most often you can tell something about what they must be cooking on a regular basis, which is all part of their identity. So everything about us is wrapped up in those objects, which is a very archeological way of thinking about our surroundings. You know, we know you’re a writer, and we know you’re published writer, and we know that’s one of your passions. Do you think that there is such a thing as a true writing process? Well, no. An honest answer. Yes, very well. You know, I have, I’ve looked at things about writing, very tangentially. And you see sometimes students who are like, well, I want to be a writer. What do I need to do to be a writer? And I kind of laugh because I say you can’t want to be a writer, you either already are a writer or you’re not. Because if you are thinking about words as fragments that you put together, writing, I think is the most powerful of the creative arts because it can be infinitely duplicated. If you are making something that’s physical like a quilt or a ceramic vessel or a painting, you know, you have to take a picture of it in order to be able to circulate it. But words can be repeated, copied and distributed faster than any other kind of creative enterprise. And so words are incredibly powerful, but they’re also malleable and they’re changeable. And if you speak any language, you can use that language to put together something in writing. And you might think to yourself, oh, you know, I haven’t got time to write. I haven’t got time to be creative. What about your grocery list? You know, turn that into something fun. You know, think about your other to do list. Get a fun pen. And think about that as a creative approach to something that’s mundane. I think that once you start looking for those opportunities to do something creative with what’s in your hand, even if it’s a boring yellow pad of paper and a boring, you know, stick pen. Wow, you can do something with that. And that’s what I would advocate. I like what you said about the shopping list because ninja can relate to start a shopping list and I will go add things that are so random and so bizarre that you’re like, why are you putting this on my list? Just a way of expressing myself creatively. Apparently. Absolutely. That’s an everyday opportunity for creativity and I completely endorse that. Yeah, well, thank you. Yes. And we know you have equated the writing process to the process of making music, share it with us, your thoughts on that. So I’m very fortunate in having a circle of friends that includes artists who work in multiple media and also musicians who work on multiple instruments. 00:40:11 – 00:45:07 And what I’ve realized by watching them is that, for example, an instrument can play many different kinds of music. So violin, we might think of as being associated with classical music when people first start to learn to play. But there’s also, you know, jazz two is for violin. There’s also little tunes for violin. And that same instrument can play a whole variety of different music. And the same is true for the writing process. And so, you know , if I’m writing a skull of the article with lots of jargon, I can pivot and write a LinkedIn blog post or I can write a poem or I can write a book that is for a wider readership or I can write an email to a student. I mean, it’s amazing what I do today actually. All the different kinds of writing that I do. And that to me is sort of like picking up an instrument and sort of meandering from one tune to the next. That’s an interesting observation. Yes, very much so. Because in music, people will say, oh, I only love classical music or I only love country. But when they have the opportunity to listen to a great classical work, all of a sudden it changes their thinking and they go, well, maybe that’s not so bad after all, and conversely, the opposite has become true. I know when we ask people, they go, oh, I don’t like classical music. You say, well, listen to this one piece. Let me know what you think. If they could totally stay awake, sometimes it just relaxes them so much. They fall asleep. But writing is certainly like that. I love when they come back and they go, I love that. I didn’t know I liked classical music or I didn’t know I liked jazz. It’s such a, it’s interesting how we’re so easily put into a very narrow road of what we prefer when we’re just not exposed to it. And literature is very much the same. Yeah, very much so. And, you know, when you think about music, that’s also often very fragmentary. So if you think about music that is associated with advertising, that’s usually a part of a song, often classical music or music of the movies, or if you want to think about how little snippets of music invade your head, think about the concept of the earworm from your in a grocery store and you hear a song and you really don’t like that song, but you can’t escape it. It’s going to be in your head all day or somebody walking down the sidewalk. Whistles a little piece of a tune that you really like. And that fragment and gets in your head and you have a great day because somebody took you off to that little piece of music. Yeah. That’s so true. Annoyingly. Annoyingly sometimes. But still, yeah, true. Monica in this question we like to ask everyone. And 5 words or less, what would your advice be to people that want to live or be more creative? And you certainly have a lot of experience in that area. So here is my I used up all 5 words. My phrase is. What will you remember more? And let me explain that. So sometimes when you see life advice or something like that, they’re like, oh, you know, think of your best life. What are you going to remember the most? No, no, no. This is not that thing. What will you remember more? Is the recipe for every day that you have the chance to do something that’s slightly different but not what you expected. You know, like your friend says, let’s go sit under a tree and eat our lunch and you’re thinking, no, I have to answer these emails. You know, then the question is, what are you going to remember more? Are you going to remember more sitting and answering your emails or going with your friend and sitting under a tree? That’s what I try to think about. Whenever I’ve got things to do, and something pops up, I’m like, what am I going to remember more? Or my students are saying, you know, oh, you know, I’ve got to go and study this thing and my friend asked me to go and do this or my dog wants to go for a walk or whatever. And I think to myself, and I tell them, what are you going to remember more, go and do that thing? True, we get pulled so many directions that probably aren’t always the best for us. They’re time wasters, or they contaminate our thinking, and then we really don’t enjoy those subtle little minutes that we can experience throughout the day, like just simply smelling a flower. That’s so true. So true. Okay, so now we’re going to ask you the question that we ask all of our guests, which is if you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past, who would it be? So that’s a pretty challenging question. 00:45:08 – 00:49:13 I thought about being disobedient and going to the future instead of the past. But I’ll close in in homage to my grandmother, my French grandmother. And, you know, she was a person who was always very optimistic and cheerful and she had had an amazing life. She was born in 1899, and she passed away in 2001. And in her lifetime, she saw the first airplanes, and she also saw people go to the moon. And her life was from a very ordinary background of village life, she eventually moved into a city. But the things that she saw, I don’t think any human generation will see that range of technological change in their lifetimes. And so if I could sit and talk with her again, that would be beautiful. But because of the things that she’s left behind, both the fragments of memory and the little objects here and there. I don’t have to wait for that once opportunities to sit on a bench. I feel like she’s always with me. And if you were to choose someone in the future I would go and visit the people who will be the age of my great grandchildren. I don’t know if I’ll have great grandchildren, but there will be people there. And I would love to go and see what they do and what the world looks like because even though we often think of many things happening that are not so great. There are things that are still fantastic in the future. And I would love to see what those things are. That would be exciting. It would be exciting. It could be wonderful or it could be a drill challenge. I think like most civilizations have the good and the in between and the band. It’s normal. And that’s what the archeological perspective tells us. Do you know that all the good capacities of people and all the capacities that we sort of wish we didn’t have, but that are part of our sort of intellectual emotional biological baggage, those things will continue in the future and yet they’re going to invent some new stuff. It’s going to be cool. Yeah. Definitely. A new iPhone. A new iPhone. iPhone 45. Exactly. Well, Monica, you are truly living a life filled with discovery. And we’re so glad you were able to share some of your experiences with this. I really kind of hate to end this because you’ve been doing it. Fascinating to listen to. And I know our listeners are going to really enjoy this episode. Absolutely is so true rod and thank you, Monica. And if our listeners would like to know more about Monica, we will have links for her under the show guest tab on thought rob podcast dot com. So everyone can learn more about her and connect with her on social media and please check out her website. Yeah, by all means check out her website and her book. And her book, which we will have a link to. And it also has an audio version. Yeah. If you don’t want to read something that Monica narrated correct Monica? That’s right. That’s right. Thank you so much. It’s been wonderful being here. I really enjoyed our conversation and you know, I encourage everyone to go out and pick up a little fragment of time of memory of music, thought and put it together into some language for the rest of us to enjoy. Thank you. Excellent. Thank you. Thank you. Bye bye. Bye bye. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas we shared with you. We post a new podcast every week so remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts, so you don’t miss an episode. So it’s by for now from my husband rod and I wishing everyone a great day. Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 37: Sixtine Crutchfield – Fame Fine Art & International Art Management Sixtine Crutchfield is a formidable force in the art world. She shares with us her passion in the sometimes difficult world of the international art market. One of her most recent accomplishments was designing and implementing the Geneva School of Business – Fine Art International Management (FAIM) MBA program – A Business Graduate Degree in Fine Art. Anyone that is pursuing a high-level career in the art world will want to hear what Sixtine Crutchfield has to share. This episode will give everyone the opportunity to listen in on her fascinating life, and life events that led her on the path to fine art and the world of creativity.   Show Notes: Episode 37: Sixtine Crutchfield Fame Fine Art & International Art Management 00:00:17 – 00:05:16 I see you’re moving your lips over there, but I don’t hear anything. I’m saying a tongue twister under my breath. Really, share it with me. Rubber baby buggy bumpers. Say that three times. Okay, I’m gonna say it once. Rubber baby buggy bumpers. That’s good. That makes me giggle. It really helps to be words. Good. It should help me too. So remember rubber baby buggy bumpers. Okay, let’s say it fast. Hi everyone and here we are celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice. I’m rod Jones. And I’m Angie Jones. Welcome to the thought rob podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen. And we’re available virtually anywhere you listen to podcasts and also you can check us out at thought rope podcast dot com. We’d love to hear from you. Don’t be shy. You can always leave us a question on our contact page, right? On the contact form. Website. Absolutely. We would love to hear from you. And that’s why this show is called thought rope podcast because we want to hear your thoughts. Well, speaking of thoughts, how about your thoughtful quote? He made that word. I like it. Okay, here is my quote for today. The alchemy of good curating amounts to this. Sometimes placing one work of art near another makes the other one. It’s like one plus one equals three. Two artworks arranged all comically leave each intact, transform both and create a third thing. And that is by our friend Jerry saltz. Oh, yes, Jerry saltz, the art critic for The New York Times. Yes, absolutely. And actually, he’s got a lot of quotes, but then again, he’s been in this industry for a long time. He does, and he’s seen a lot and he’s experienced a lot, so I bet he does have a lot of quotes. He’s a lot to say. You know what I like about this one is because you and I have been to a lot of our museums. I know curators will lay the paintings out to create a flow through a museum, so they can move the people through and you go from one painting to another page, another painting. But I’ve noticed just basically what Jerry Seoul said here is you’ll see a weaker painting and it might be positioned between two very strong paintings and then all of a sudden you’re more attracted to the weaker painting. It just brings something out in it, and who’s really to say one painting is better than you really can’t because it resonates with people differently and sometimes maybe a more quiet quote quiet painting is not really very quiet at all. Well, it’s always subject to people’s interpretation, their life experiences, what they like, some person may like flower scenes and other person maybe lean towards a strong abstract. Right. It’s what resonates with you. And sometimes you’re surprised about what you might enjoy to and what resonates with you on that day as well. It’d be interesting to see an abstract between two floral arrangements and see how people gravitate to that. Yeah, that would be really an interesting take on having a floral and then abstracts around it. And the other thing that I read about and heard about was George O’Keefe when they would lay out her shows, she was always there and she said everything up along the wall and then she’d walk around and she’d move things around and sometimes for several hours. Sometimes she would say look, we’re going to do this again tomorrow and she’d come back and move her paintings around even more. It was very frustrating for the museum staff and the curators and all that. But she had a way that she wanted to keep the harmony between each piece of her art. That makes sense that she would do that, plus she knew or better than anybody. Exactly, but also it was how she wanted her artwork to be presented in the feel and the mood, the impression she wanted to leave with people that were viewing it. Literally can tell a story, especially if it’s a solo art exhibition from one painting to the next you can tell a story, or how sometimes they start out with the earliest paintings and end up with the latest paintings, and everybody walks around and go, well, I really liked what he did in the beginning. 00:05:17 – 00:10:01 I hate what he’s doing now, or she’s doing now. Sometimes sometimes that does happen, but it’s kind of cool when you can see the whole body of work as well. But now it’s going to be your turn rod. We are ready for rods motivational moment. Uh oh. Well, here it is. It’s actually a quote that I came up with. In response to something, I don’t remember what it was. But here it is. The sole reveals beauty that the eyes can not see, but the heart can hear. That’s absolutely beautiful and so tell us about that a little. Well, I don’t, I mean, I get the impression. It works for me anyway. I feel something about something that I see creatively. I feel it deep inside. And then, later, my brain has to take over and process it. So I think the soul actually reveals or sees beauty first before your brain tunes into it. That’s why I say, but the heart can hear because your heart hears it in my opinion. You feel it in your heart, and then all of a sudden it manages to percolate its way up to your brain and then once it gets there, then the opinion start and experiences that you’ve had in past life or whatever all of a sudden start to take over what you felt deep down inside. Right. I couldn’t agree more. And I think that in our very busy modern society sometimes that sort of gets a little overrun by maybe visuals or what’s in or what’s not in and what society thinks is cool or not. So it’s kind of if you can keep it at a soul level and your spiritual level, probably you will get more out of what you’re feeling and looking at. I like that. I think you interpreted my quote probably better than I did. I don’t know about that. What you said, I thought that was really profound. But I also think that you’re coming about being bombarded being basically told how to think you’re being told. It’s acceptable and what’s not. Right, and if you mention this before, if you listened to that still small voice inside you, maybe it’s going to reveal the beauty that is actually there and your eyes can’t see it. But your heart can hear it. Right. And your spirit can hear it. Yeah. Absolutely. I’m also often curious what creativity can teach us. Good point. You know? And I have to say that on a recent post that I made, I was really, really reticent about posting this particular painting. Oh yes, I remember. Right. It was just, it was very agonizing because I felt very like it was unfinished or something was it right with it or I don’t want to say insecure because that sounds so like you want accolades from others. It wasn’t that kind of insecurity. It was more of like, I don’t know if anybody will really it will resonate with anyone. And I don’t know if it resonates with myself. So it was kind of like I wanted to make sure that people were having an experience viewing this painting and I didn’t feel confident in that. And what was interesting is what it taught me when I actually did post it because you convinced me that I should. Yeah, absolutely. I think it would have been a waste for you not to. I saw that painting hanging around your studio for a while. More than one occasion, I said, are you ever going to post that? Not too positive about it or thinking that I don’t know, maybe I can do something better. I don’t think there’s an artist in the world. I don’t care if you’re a composer or a musician or in the theater. You always think you can do a better job. Nobody’s ever satisfied. Absolutely. But in this case, in this case, it did turn out to be a good thing, because once I posted it, I felt a very freeing experience about it. And also, it taught me that, you know, you don’t necessarily have to fit in the confines of being good or bad. It’s more about your creative expression. And I think that’s the part that really was very inspiring for me and a learning tool for me. What I thought was interesting is garnered a lot of response, which I was really surprised. A lot of interesting comments. The comments themselves were revealing about the piece of art. 00:10:02 – 00:15:04 Everybody liked it. I don’t think they were all just being polite, honestly think they liked it. But it also triggered some thing in your own imagination that when you do create a piece of art, most artists are never really truly satisfied with it. They always think that they can do something better at a friend of mine than several years ago that always used to say the problem with art is no artist ever thinks it’s finished, and he always wants to go over and add one more brush stroke. That’s true. And the thing about this piece that’s really made me feel super happy about it and I know that others really enjoyed it this way is the conversation. I think that part of it was the most enlightening. Yeah, well, speaking of conversation, we talked to a lot of people in this podcast about creativity, as you know. And our listeners know. The common theme I see is that they’re really passionate about what they do. Yeah, I think that’s really true. But I also think about I think about being inspired like you have to be inspired to be passionate because of your creative drive. So it kind of it’s like the LEGO blocks of creativity when you have all that. Yeah, sure. And inspiration, inspiration comes from a lot of different sources. But it’s kind of interesting to know or figure out is there a bridge between being inspired, and where a passion starts? Exactly. I don’t exactly know what that is. But I think you can be inspired to build or create something. Compose a great symphony, whatever, write a book, you’re inspired to write a book. But as you get into writing that book, all of a sudden, your passions hopefully take over. And that’s what makes it turn out to be such an incredible piece, right? So true, so true. And I think you have to check it in your brain, though, to make sure that you’re not just doing it for motivation to get the end result instead of being inspired and having passion and having the creative drive. One of the things before we move on here, one of the things I want to say is a lot of times you’re inspired because you think you’re going to look good or are you going to make a lot of money or people are going to be really impressed by what you’re doing? Yeah. I think you really have to have passion about something that you’re doing creatively. If you get the accolades, that’s fine. And if you don’t, that’s fine, too. Because it’s the experience that you personally have inside is the most important thing I believe. So true. And while we’re on the subject of being having inspire life or being inspired, let’s bring on our guest. Okay, so today we’re going to be speaking with 16 crutchfield. 16. Welcome to the thought robe podcast were really very excited to have a conversation with you regarding your career in the art world. It’s just great to have you with us today. It’s high 16. I agree and we are so excited to hear about your latest project as well. Hi, and she hi rob. Thank you very much for having me. It’s a great honor to be with you guys today. Thank you in honor for us to say. So, okay, we’re going to start out our interview by asking you, what did you have for breakfast? Well, I’m not very good at breakfast. I know it’s the main meal of the day, but I usually have a big mug of fresh home ground coffee brood and a bit of milk and a banana. That’s good. That’s healthy. That’s healthy. As long as you get a little caffeine and fruit, you’re good. It’s a potassium from the banana. It’s interesting how many people love this question 16. Every time they go, just love that question because people eat fascinating fasting breakfasts anywhere from a cup of coffee to something more complicated. Yeah. Anyway, I want to get to your name. 16. It’s a kind of a pretty name. It’s a very beautiful name, actually. And it’s unusual. They have to say that. Tell us the story behind it. Well, I have my dad to thank for that, obviously I had no input whatsoever at the time, but I was born in the 60s in Europe at the time. There was a lot of American music going on and so my dad was all into The Rock and roll in the Elvis Presley’s and all that. 00:15:04 – 00:20:00 And when I was born, he wanted to call me 16 as in sweet 16 with the doubly in. But in those days when you went to church to get christened, there was a list of names that you could have and you couldn’t sort of, you know, the priest would allow you to name your baby this so that name and not another. So they said was 16 wasn’t on, obviously, it wasn’t an a Christian name as such. And so he said, well, yes, it is. There’s the Sistine Chapel. So an in French the Sistine Chapel spells SI xt IE. So it became so you go. The priest couldn’t think. And so but it’s been a great name. I love it. I mean, it’s the best door opener that anywhere. And I’ve mainly been a lot in the Anglo Saxon world, whether in Australia and Europe and England or I was in an English boarding school for a while. So, yeah, everybody always questions. They remember it for sure. I remember you and your name. It’s called branding. Branding. I love it. I have a nickname in Miami because I’ve been to art by so Miami, many, many times. And there’s a very good friend of mine over there who’s Cuban, his name is Eddie, and he calls me 13. That’s very funny. Okay. So before we go on to the different projects you’ve managed and talk about them, we know that you lived you live in Geneva Switzerland currently, which is gorgeous. But where are you originally from? And when we talked initially on the phone, you had mentioned you spent some time living in Australia. Share with us your journey. Yeah, I was born in Switzerland. I was actually born in Basel, which is in the German speaking part of Switzerland. And then my parents moved to Geneva when I was about three or four. My dad Swiss, my mom’s German. And I was sent to an English boarding school because it was like it’s a family tradition and my mom’s family, everybody was sent to boarding school. So that was that. So that’s where I learned my English from the age of ten to 17. And then so I’ve been working and doing all my studies, but also working later, always in English or more in English than in French, even though French is my mother tongue I should say. And yeah, I ended up going to Australia with the Picasso, the Marina Picasso collection. And that was in 1984. And then I went, I loved it. I mean, I was there for ten days and it was all work work work. But I really wanted to go back there. So in 1988, was the bicentennial for Australia and the people who had organized the Marina Picasso exhibition asked me if I had asked them if there was ever a job for me in Australia that I could come and travel a little bit. I’d be delighted. So they asked me for the bicentennial and I ended up going there. I was supposed to go there for a couple of weeks and I stayed 11 years. Oh, boy. Oh, wow, that’s a good time. I married an Australian, so that was part of the 11 years. But always having been in the art world I ended up we were in Darwin at the time because my husband worked for a company, which was providing material for the mining industry. So up and down in the 70,000 people, 90% of them are Aboriginal people. And I ended up with the art world is not much, I mean, there’s a very, very good museum up there. And then there’s the Australia council, which is like the ministry of culture, if you like and I loved it, I got a job there and we worked for the theater, which was called browns Marx community theater. And as I said, 90% of the population is Aboriginal. So all of the projects, the cultural projects, whether B theater dance music or fine arts or even poetry and literature is usually Australian Australian indigenous culture, which is great. That way when I stayed and we stayed in Darwin for three years and when I stayed there, I didn’t get homesick because I had it was just so different. Sometimes I’d go to the office and my boss, guy called Ken Conway, he would say, okay, we’re taking the plane today and we’re going to men in greedo, which is like a three, 45 minute flight. Along the north coast of Australia. So, you know, that could have never happened to me in Europe. So me coming from a gallery where we looked at Picasso and modern art and all of a sudden I was doing back paintings and dot paintings and dreamings and it was just fabulous. I loved it. Well, you know, that kind of leads me to my next question. 00:20:00 – 00:25:02 That is most everything that you’ve done in your business career has been related to art. In one way or another, share with us and our listeners, how that came about. And when you first got excited or interested in creativity in the art world. Well, probably it starts because I’m lazy at heart. When I was at boarding school, it was a system. It was an English boarding school and it was called O levels and a levels. So you did your own levels when you were about 15 and you do about anywhere between 11 and 14, 15 subjects. And then after that, you do your a levels and you pick three max four. And so I was pretty good at art and my art teach our art teacher liked me or I was pet teacher a little bit. And so I did my aunt O level and I did okay. And then I did my art a level only because it seemed easier to do than biology or geography or physics or chemistry. So in my a levels I took in an English boarding school so I took French and German because they were languages already new. And then I took art. And then my history of art teacher pushed me. She said, do you a level history of art as well? So I ended up doing both. And that was probably the actual subject where I had to learn the most in those art classes where you actually painting and treating art. Yes, I was, yeah. And I didn’t. I still do draw a bit. I love anything on paper, whether it’s watercolor or pencil, but I’ve never actually professionally practiced art. I’ve always been on the business side or on the admin side or on the logistics side. But I’ve never I’m not an artist by any means like you guys. I’m very jealous. You know, being on the business side is extremely good. That probably more so than pushing around the cameras. Certainly use more parts of your brain. And then so I continued that with, you know, from my a levels I then went to university and again, I was in Denver, Colorado, and I did bachelors of mass communications. And then we had to choose then miners. And so I did history of the theater and history of art. And just continued on. I thought I was going to be on stage, but no, that didn’t happen, and I’m glad it didn’t. And yeah, so I just continued with history of art. And then I went on, I came back to Geneva. And got my first job as being a gallery assistant, but it was gallery and cuisine, which is one of the top was at the time one of the top galleries top ten. I’d say in the world, we represented Marina Picasso collection, but also other we had a lot of I mean it was like working in a museum. It was just unbelievable. And so in a way, it was lucky that I landed my first job there, but in another way you become a little bit blase. So to find to change from that and to sort of in Geneva other than the encrypt, there wasn’t much going on, still isn’t much going on. Then that’s also what pushed me to become independent because any other job in Geneva wasn’t going to cut it. I think so. Yeah, it sounds like you’ve got a little spoiled because it was just such a vibrant environment. And high level. And high level, yeah, it was and also, like, you have to remember, I’m just graduated. So I’ve got I’m 22 years old and we were doing this Picasso itinerary show, which took me to Australia. In those days, the insurance companies insisted on a conveyor on the plane with the painting. So and that was always sort of the youngest or the assistant, so that was me. And so, you know, I flew to the states. I flew to Germany and Japan and Italy and I was just great. And I thought, oh, I like the working environment. That’s nice. It’s very nice. Babysitting job. Yeah, very nice. And I mean, nothing ever happened. So, you know, like it easygoing. The true. I had one funny experiment. This was in Australia in 1984. When you arrive in Australia, I don’t know if you know they spray you. Again, you know, it’s an island, so they protect each other, you know, themselves from any sort of disease or whatever. Right now with COVID, they’re under complete lockdown. But in 1984, so they would spray the cabin. But then they don’t, and they still don’t allow any wood inside. And I’m arriving with two or three palette falls of Picasso’s. Of course, inwards, traits. So their modern had been treated. And framed, right? And framed it. And also stretched on wood and you know, and that wood is well Picasso’s age. So they were going to spray the paintings. And I said, there’s just no way you’re spraying anything on any of these works of art. It was very it took me a long time to get through customs. They had to get all sorts of special authorizations because there was just no way. 00:25:02 – 00:30:01 I didn’t know what they were spraying, and I wasn’t going to let them spray any of my. So that was probably the only time where I had to exercise some authority as a conveyor of the painting. That’s pretty the first time they actually had to face it too. And now they probably have a protocol for it. That’s very interesting. Right around the world. China, they spray everything, too. There’s other countries that are starting to do that. Maybe there’s a protocol specifically for that. Because paintings, like you said, they’re stretched on wood in most cases. You can’t spray a solvent that’s aerosol on things. Too. Yeah. Yeah, I wasn’t going to take that risk, especially not on my first sort of job in 22 years old. There’s no way I was going to do that sometimes. And also, the sum of the stretchers had holes like, you know, like, worm, but obviously they’ve been treated in Europe, but I mean, you know, there was no more worms in the thing, but to the estranged, it’s like, you know, this is bad wood. And I said, well, no, it’s not. Yeah, for sure. Just age at this point. I know Angie has a question for you. Yeah, I was going to ask art management seems to be a prevalent theme in your current projects. Could you let us know more about that? Yeah, your art management. Yeah. About 15 years ago, I became independent. I was working for a company that was organizing art fairs, but yeah, about 15 years ago, I became independent and there’s a lot of things called art advisory who are people who know about history of art and who advise collectors or pension funds or banking bankers or anybody who buys art what to buy and why, et cetera and follow, if you like the light motif of each collection. And I thought, well, I can do that, but I also think that a lot of collectors don’t take the time to put a proper inventory together to photograph their works to get proper insurance to get proper condition reports. They don’t do all that sort of documentation that should be with any sort of painting. And depending where they get the painting from, there’s no the provenance is not always clear or the bibliography, et cetera. And I found that when people came to me to say, I want to buy a painting or I want to sell it painting. We wasted a lot of time putting everything together to make sure the value the evaluation of the painting was correct, because if the provenance is not complete or if, you know, the condition report is not well done or whatever it plays on the value of the piece. And I thought, instead of having collectors come to me and then spending two years trying to get all the paperwork together so that we can sell it at the right price. I would offer collectors to maintain or to put their paperwork in order. So that when they sell, they can do it straight away. Very good. That’s very good advice. Yeah. And so and that’s what I was doing. So rather than being an art adviser, which, of course, I’m happy to do if somebody asks me to I very often take collectors around art Basel or whatever. And then we walk together. And we talk about what they need and what they want and what excites them, et cetera, and I do that on a regular basis, but I also follow through with a lot of clients and just make sure the inventories are correct. Usually the clients who have who use my services will have big collections like I worked on the UCA collection, which belonged to mister and misses ulans, Belgium collectors, obviously I did the same work at gallant cuisine with the Picasso collection, but also terrorist Garcia. Usually they’re bigger collections. I worked on a Cuban collection as well, which was very interesting with Cuban artists from the 40s. So it’s a lot of bookworm work actually. And then just research and all of that, which I like doing. That falls under the category of art consulting, I guess. And if so, what have been your greatest challenges and your successes for you personally in that area? What I find really gratifying is that when you do the work and then you have a show or you put pieces up in a foundation because it’s a private collection starting a foundation and you hang them and you get in a good result you get good comments from the press and good comments from the public. And that I find really gratifying because it means you’ve done a good job and the collection is complete and it’s well set up and hung et cetera. The other thing I find very gratifying is when you estimate to work and then you take it to other bees or Christie’s or whatever option house and it does well and within the parameters that you had set in the first place. So whenever you’re not wrong, basically it’s kind of a nice feeling. I can imagine. I bet it is. You’re providing a tremendous service for both the collector and people that want to view the collections. 00:30:02 – 00:35:03 People have an opportunity to actually see the collection, which is pretty important because a lot of art is held privately and doesn’t always see the light of day. A lot of people don’t have the opportunity to see some of these special pieces that have been collected over the years. Yeah. But it’s also what’s nice is that usually even if they kept privately, I’ve had opportunities like that just to create a catalog for that collection, which is going to be held by the collector. But at the end of the day, when you’ve got the finished product and it’s printed and that person says, oh, well, you know what? I showed it to my insurance, and they were really happy because it was just such an easy document to work with. That sort of thing I think is also rewarding. Sometimes you take time because, you know, I mean, I have mandates and I get paid by the hour and people don’t understand that it takes that amount of time because there’s just two background to work on. But I’ve not had any bad experiences as such. I mean, I’ve given conferences as well. One thing I’m a little bit disappointed with is that I’ve had a short stint in a private bank. And I was doing the art advisory then. We had this little department or section very ultra high net worth people. And the customers or the clients were super happy. But sometimes the bankers I tried to then on my own offer that service to different bankers and a lot of the Swiss banks are not they’re not reacting yet. They haven’t quite yet understood the importance of art and how they can improve their own banking service and financial advisory if they knew a little bit more or if they had a service with art. I always say the client, whether he’s an investor in a bank, if he, you know, if he has a passion, it can be arched but it also can be vintage or a vintage cars or a wine or whatever it is. But if you’re financial adviser, knows about your passion and can actually exchange with you on the subject, it makes all the difference. Sure. Definitely. You know, I wanted to ask you, I know you have organized various events. Can you tell us about that? Yeah, that was actually a funny story. When I came back from Australia, that’s when I went to the bank because I wanted to change like have a bit of a different environment, as I send my first job was Jan cuisine and yeah, just coming back to Geneva. There was nothing else. And mister cougar didn’t say come back. And I just needed to do something different. I have to say, as well, that while I was in Australia, I kept in touch with the gallery and I would come back to art Basel and do the fares with them that gave me also the opportunity to come home and visit my family. So I’ve always been in touch with cuisine. We even did an exhibition of Picasso prints in Melbourne, which was a good success as well. So we’ve always in touch. So when I came back, he said, please come back. And I said, no, I wanted to do something else. So I worked in the bank and then the bank that I worked for was taken over. So again, he called me and says, come back, so I did go back together, because this was in 2003. And we had signed up to do a show which is it’s a contemporary art show called art mosca. And basically, mister Crozier had not been back to the east. He’s originally Polish, but had not been back to the east since after the war. And so the Second World War. So he was very excited about going to Moscow and just had all this nostalgia going on. And I then saw an ad in the Geneva local newspaper to say that there was another show which was taking place a week after the one that we had enrolled for. And it seemed a lot more important as in modern work not just so much that we were doing contemporary, but this was more our league. So I went to see the guy who was organizing the show and he said, yeah, but we’re full. They had like 27 exhibitors. And I mean, when you work with cujo, you’re a bit pedantic. So I said, you know how? You organize the show, and you don’t come and see us, et cetera and the guys said, okay, well, I see what I can do. And we got a I think we had like 35 m², which is nothing. We usually have a 150 m² stands. But I said to mister cuisine, look, we’re ready there. We might as well take a just a few paintings, but we need to be in this other show as well. So we decided to do that. And while I was there, we then had to do this was in May and we had to do Basel in June. And I again I met with the organizer of the fair, and he said, why don’t you come and work for me? And I said, well, I don’t know how to run an art fair. I’ve got no idea. And he says, neither do I. So and I said, look, I mean, I’m like, I’m representing one of your top galleries here. 00:35:03 – 00:40:15 And then I’m going to art Basel. I really don’t have time to think about this. And I wasn’t really all that happy to be back at kuji is because I thought I’d sort of closed a loop. And I wasn’t ready to do that yet. So I was quite tempted by the prospect, but I just thought, you know, I’m totally out of my comfort zone. Anyway, then I met the guy again. And I started to work for him on the 1st of August. And that was how we started running the show and we went from that was 27 or 28 exhibitors and the following year there was 56 and then after that, we got up to a 120 to well medium sized archery. I mean, it wasn’t anything like art Basel, or no, but that’s I mean, that’s substantial. It is substantial. You can imagine a lot of work that went into it. You’re not going to change the topic just a little bit here. We’ve read about and learned that you designed the NBA program for the Geneva business school. That sounds like a major project. I must say, but I suspect it’s been very rewarding for you. How did all that happen? Well, that’s another good story. All my stories sort of link into one into the other. So that your life’s journey. That’s your life journey. That’s the activity that’s an exciting one and you have to say, don’t grass has grown under your feet. It’s not at all. Yeah, and I suppose I’ve always followed my intuition and I’m lucky enough that I’ve always done what I’ve wanted to do. But you were able to define what you want to do. So many people bounce around and flow with different ideas and they never seem to coalesce any one. But you went from one adventure to another. They all connected the connectivity of everything that you’re doing is so it’s a flawless and flowing. It’s wonderful. It’s interesting. Yeah. Yeah, I suppose there’s a focus with art, really. I mean, there’s anything to do with culture and creativity. I’m interested in. And the rest I may be, maybe I just lock it out. But anyhow with the MBA, it’s been a wonderful journey because I started so I did when I started at the bank, I obviously had no idea this was when I came back from Australia about finance and banking. So the bank employed me basically for this art advice division that they wanted to create. But I still had to have some basics about finance. So they sent me to a school called Geneva business school. This was in 1999. And I did the course and the deal was that if I pass, they will pay for the tuition and then I owed them two years after that to work with them. And if I failed the course, I would have to pay for the tuition. Oh. And so I passed and that was that. And then ten years later, the school was just starting. It was a new school that was actually supported and sponsored by the Swiss banking association. And I think I was like the third intake. Anyway, and then ten years later, they because I like to stay in touch with most of the people I meet. They asked me if I wanted to be a part of the ten anniversary as in the alumni and gather, do a table or two at their celebration, which I did. And so that was 2009. And then that’s it. I’m sort of left to school. But I stayed and Friends with the owner of the school and 2019, he asked me again because it was coming up to the 25th anniversary, or the 20th anniversary. And would I do the same thing? And I said, yeah, sure. And they’re celebrations where plans sort of in March, 2020, which of course, the whole world won’t enter. And so I had contacted the alumni and all that, but nothing happened in the end. And I said, by that time, they had also for their own admin reasons. They had employed me. So I was quite happy because the culture side of things of the world. Like I had no projects going or anything so I was very fortunate and grateful to be employed. And I said, why don’t we do something with the art? You guys do MBAs on sport management on oil and gas management and basically the art industry and the art market has been buoyant for 25 years. So you could use that as an anniversary synergy and you can and I’ll get it all together for you. So I started calling up on all my network and we decided on 7 modules. Obviously, we had to follow the educational side of things. There’s lots of parameters. You know, it has to be equivalent. And we have accreditation in the states and in Europe. You know, there’s certain rules that you have to follow. So I worked very closely with the academics department, and we decided on 7 modules, which are history of art, art law, art finance, entrepreneurship, like a gallery, event management, museology, and logistics. And then I sort of started thinking, who are the top ten in the world that do these that have these activities? And so I pulled them up and I have to say 100% of the people I contacted followed me and said, yeah, sure, we’ll teach. 00:40:16 – 00:45:09 Of course it’s online and it’s evening classes. So it allows both professors and students to keep on doing their professional activities. Was there was there are law involved in this? Yes, there is. There’s a firm called la Liv in Geneva. They actually founded the art law foundation for the university of Geneva. And I have the lawyer sundry jihu who’s designed the art law program. A very impressive. That’s very impressive. And then we’ve got Adriano pitching out. He works for Deloitte and Luxembourg, and he’s been running the art sector for Deloitte’s for many, many years, and he writes the reports. He does all sorts of things. So he’s going to be also one of our teachers. We’ve got my restellini who’s got the restellini institute for forensics. He does lab studies on paintings. But he also wrote the catalog resume for a Madeira modigliani. Okay. You know, they’re all very impressive people. So I’m really pleased and it’s given me the opportunity to rekindle with everybody. And we’ve got Lorenzo Rudolph who’s supporting the project. He’s the one who founded art Basel Miami and he was one of the founding members of art Basel. I mean, we’ve got really, really top notch professors. So I’m really pleased. You’re lucky they were lucky to know you so they had this opportunity. This is a pretty exciting opportunity for them to share the knowledge that they’ve gained over their life’s experiences. Yeah, I think we’re all feeling the same thing. It’s like a little bit of loop like, you know, we’re all sort of of the 60s or a little bit younger, but we, you know, like, all the expertise and experience that we’ve gained. We’re sort of now sharing with these new students. I think the luckiest of the lot of the students to show us anybody that has the opportunity to go to the Geneva business school and take advantage of this program because there’s such a force of you’re not going to get that structure in the world. There’s nowhere else in the world that you would have that opportunity. No. Yeah, honestly, I mean it’s without patting myself on the shoulder, but I did do some market research. And I don’t think there is another cause quite as informal because it’s going to be fun. And that’s what I wanted. So all these people are active, but they’re also super creative and visionary. So I mean, it’s going to be exciting. Anyone who’s interested in the art industry even as a banker or as a lawyer, it doesn’t matter, you know, it’s going to be they’re going to meet all the right people and the networking is going to be tremendous. True. And then you’ll also be helping your client by having a better understanding if they have a considerable art collection or any kind of collection as you stated earlier that way. Yes, you know how to manage and deal with it. Yeah, no, I think even we’ve had, I mean, I’ve had some really good applicants like there’s a guy in Germany. He’s 40 years old. He’s been in logistics and shipping all his life and he wants to specialize in art. And he’s signed up to the course. I just think that’s wonderful. It is wonderful. The logistics are a critical part of moving art around the world. It is. Some understanding there. It is. Now I’m going to ask you about something a little bit different. And it’s the red pencil project. Tell us about your involvement in that and what that is. Well, that’s been something that was very close to my heart. I’m no longer on the board due to lack of time, unfortunately, but I follow them closely. The red pencil was founded by a Belgium lady who’s an art therapist in Singapore, but she’s now back in Belgium. Her name is Laurence vandenberg, and she created a pool of qualified art therapists throughout the world who donate up to three weeks of their time on a cause and the red pencil operates in anywhere in the world where there’s extreme poverty or pandemic right now. It’s worldwide, but I mean, with or there’s been a war disaster or anything. An earthquake or whatever natural disaster. And so they go there and it’s a three phase program. They go there as the emergency and they stay about ten days. And they saw that they usually we started out by working with the children only in those areas when there was a tsunami in the Philippines. Because we felt that the children were the most lost because all the adults and the guys from the Red Cross and everything who are doing wonderful jobs, they’re busy and they’re not really taking care of the children and a very often the children who’ve lost their mom or their grandma or their home or whatever. And they just left there. So the red pencil moved in and started taking care of the children and then when we got to Lebanon one year, we were in a refugee camp and we found that the mothers would not let the children come to us because everybody was super frightened. 00:45:09 – 00:50:03 So then we started to include the mothers and the sisters, et cetera, and now it’s the red pencil is really open to everyone. And they do great jobs. They work in India. They work in something like, I don’t know, a hundred countries, 122 countries in the world. And obviously they work with donations. But a lot of it is just, you know, like people being volunteers and it’s unbelievably successful as in it really helps our therapy is great. I can see why you’d be passionate about a marvelous thing. And also, so meaningful for people that are vulnerable. It gives children especially children and opportunity to kind of refocus their thinking. When you’re sitting there drawing or sketching or playing with crayons or whatever, all of a sudden you’re not thinking about what’s going on around you so much to treat focusing or thinking. That’s a wonderful project. And there’s also the saying is, you know, when you’ve got when you’ve got no words left to say, well, it was just been going, we know what you’re going through. You can do it in color and enjoying. And so the red pencil then goes back three months later and another time. So they go back three times and the second time it’s to follow up and to see how the people are doing. And the third time it teaches people how to use the tools and what to make of it themselves so that we don’t need to go back because people know how to use the functions of art therapy. And it can be art, but it can also be arts with a nest. It can be music. It can be dance. We’ve had in Nepal. We’ve had a lot of young women do story cloths like where they so patchworks of what goes on. Oh, yes. It really, really good. It’s really interesting. I’m going to have to move on a little bit here because so fascinating to talk to and we’re learning so much and we’re very excited to learn about the red pencil project. But throughout your career, you touch on this a little bit earlier, you’ve been very passionate about art and creativity, is there one driving force that you think is behind that? I just think I’m very curious and I like, I like beauty, but not as in decorative beauty. I like, you know, storytelling or even if it’s a violent message or I just like the way communicating through the image, I think. And so I’m interested in all of that. I’m interested in street art. I’m interested in if somebody is suffering that it comes out in that way. And I’m always curious wherever I travel, I’ll go to the gallery or the museum and I don’t know why. Maybe it’s in the DNA, my grandfather was also an artist. I’ve had, yeah, he was in the watch industry, but he was an enamelist. So, you know, a very good draughtsman. So maybe it’s in the DNA. I have no idea. I’m going to ask you a follow-up on that one, too. In 5 words or less, what would be your advice to people that want to live or be more creative in their lives? I mean, you certainly have managed that. Do you have a recommendation for others? 5 words isn’t much. We’re generous today. Today we’re giving you extra words. Thank you. I think what’s important is also not to renege on the past. I mean, if you’re interested in learn your history of art and learn it over and over again and go through it, go to museums and go to gallery shows and whether it’s, you know, traditional art or whether it’s contemporary art or whether it’s kinetic or now digital, but just go and see art and go and look at it and just immerse yourself and be curious. So that’s two. Then I say remain open minded. Like whenever you go somewhere and I never sort of say, you know, are they saying art and everything has potential? And so just be open minded. And our show is based on celebrate what people love to do creatively and you are a great example of celebrating what people love to do creatively. Not only for yourself, but you’ve surrounded yourself with very creative people. That’s very admirable. And exciting. I think it’s exciting. And I have to tell you something when I speak like if I meet new people and it’s happened a little bit when I was working with the NBA because I have to say, well, this academics and educational and, you know, they wanted people who had done research and whatever, and it was a little bit of a dry sometimes dry exchange. And then I’d call up someone to ask them if they wanted to be a professor for the MBA. And like immediately the conversation flows. So as I said earlier, sometimes I just seem to like if you don’t interest me, I just shut you off. Well, thank you for being on our podcast. Oh my goodness. 00:50:04 – 00:55:00 But yeah, and then I’d say work work work, work hard, and believe in yourself. And that goes for anything, not just being creative, but I think if you believe in yourself and you work hard, you’re going to be creative, whether you’re going to be a scientist or an artist. That’s very good. That’s very good about advice. For sure. And now we’re going to now ask you the question we ask all of our podcast guests and their answers are always fascinating. So if you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past, who would it be? Wow, okay. I’ll start by saying I went to a party once and Darwin and they said come as your favorite dead person. And I went as Andy. I had to Campbell’s soup can on a T-shirt and I had to blond wig, which I put on. And sit down tight. Nobody knew who I was. That’s pretty well. But if I today, to be honest, and it’s going to be very personal, but I have my grandmother’s grandmother in Germany, who was born in 1831 was an actress on the stage in Dresden and Berlin. And as I understand it, she was a little bit of a strong personality. She had a very loud voice, which she actually, I think, in the early 20th century, she flew to New York to be recorded because that was the only recording studio that she, you know, where she could record her own voice. She was achieving took photographs in those days. I mean, she was not only was she a strong woman, but I imagine she loved gadgets and anything that was novel. And she ran a salon or a boudoir in Dresden and she met people like Richard Wagner. She, you know, and she held diaries. And so I’ve read those diaries. And I’ve researched a little bit about her. So I think if I met her on the bench part, I’d love to talk to her. You can see why what a vibrant woman. She had so much going on. Yeah. I also think she was a bit of a floozy because many more men than she did women in her entourage. But that’s what made her interesting educated herself. Probably. But also back then, I think that women were mostly just in the home. They weren’t doing so many things and being so vibrant like your great grandmother. And so maybe the men were more fascinating at this more interesting because other women wouldn’t have been as interesting to her. Look at George sand, right? Exactly. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And they dressed up as then actually to be recognized. They thought and they also said, I think it was George sand said, I dress up like a man because I have more fun when I’m a man. You have probably had more interest in conversations. True for back then, that is so true. Yeah. So yeah, so I think kudos to my name was paulina Ulrich and I think she must have been a fantastic person, probably not very easy to get on with because she probably had a strong mind. But yeah, she must have been fascinating. Maybe you have some of that DNA in you. Yes. Yeah, that would be not. I’d be very honored if so many recognize that and 2016 they celebrated in Dresden the hundredth anniversary of her death. And they named the there’s a square in front of the theater and Dresden in the old Dresden, which was totally rebuilt by UNESCO because it was bombed during the Second World War. And so now there’s a square Palin and I was there, I was invited and with my other family members. And some guys said I looked like her. But I mean, I don’t see it. I don’t see anyone. That’s interesting. They would say you look more like Andy Warhol. Yeah. I would have preferred that name. Crazy in the factory there. But no. Well, you know, you’re fascinating to talk to my listeners are going to really enjoy hearing our interview with you. Both engine aren’t really thankful that you’ve taken the time to speak with us. No, I was a pleasure. I loved it. And I’m really happy that you contacted me. It was great. I really enjoyed it. Yes, thank you so much for being with us. And I agree with rod and if our listeners would like to know more about you, 16, we will have links for her under our show guest tab at our website at thought rob podcast dot com. So everyone can learn more about her. And please connect with her on social media and check out her website. Definitely do dedicated listeners. This is somebody you should really check out and learn to learn to know more about 16 and that MBA program if you’re interested. It’s quite impressive what you’ve managed to accomplish there. We’re excited for you. Thank you very much. 00:55:01 – 00:55:34 And everyone’s welcome to contact me at any time. Okay, well, they’ll have all of your info. So they’ll reach out to you. Definitely. But thank you again. This has been wonderful. All right, goodbye. Have a nice day. Thank you, YouTube. Bye bye. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas we shared with you. We post a new podcast every week so remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts, so you don’t miss an episode. So it’s by for now from my husband rod and I wishing everyone a great day.   Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

In this episode, Natali Herrera-Pacheco discusses her creative journey from her formal education in Spain and Venezuela to living the creative life in the United States. We were excited to learn about her understanding and experiences with ritual music from her native city in South America. She expresses her passion about understanding human nature and the power of family. Natali uses her camera to collect reality images of day-to-day life in today’s world.   Show Notes: Episode 36: NataliHerrera-Pacheco Photographer Writer & Artist 00:00:18 – 00:05:03 Okay so what are you drinking in that cool Yeti cup of yours? It is cool isn’t it? I really love this cup but you know in one way I wish I would have got an orange one like you have. Why? I like your white one. It looks so good but what are you drinking? Mineral water from where they think they found Noah’s ark I believe near Turkey and Armenia. Wow that’s mount all right. Well I know one thing for sure it really really helps clear my voice. And I love the taste of this stuff. Well I want to sip. Here here you go. Okay. Hi everyone and here we are celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice. I’m Rudd Jones. And I’m Angie Jones welcome to the thought rope podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen. And we’re available virtually anywhere you listen to podcasts and also check us out on thought rope podcast dot com. There you can listen to our episodes and find out a little bit more about what each guest their background is and some photos of them. And also you can drop us a line. Yes and we would love to hear from you. And don’t be shy you know it’s pretty easy to do. You just go to the contact us page and give us your thoughts. We love to hear what you have to say. Your thoughts and ideas on the thought row podcast. Plus we answer everybody. I mean we’re pretty good at that. So don’t be afraid to reach out to us. Yeah absolutely. We won’t ignore your email like when you send emails to some places sometimes you don’t get a reply back. But no we actually reply back. And it’s super easy on the contact form all you have to do is put your email type in your message and hit send. It’s really simple. Yeah in fact I think we responded to some people today. Yeah we do. Okay how about my favorite part? Your weekly quote. Okay this is a really great quote. And it’s a be brave take risk nothing can substitute experience and that’s by Paulo coelho and I’m going to tell you a little bit about him because once I got the quote I wanted to find out more about him because I wasn’t really like it didn’t jell it who it was. Okay he is a lyricist and a novelist who has become one of the most widely read authors in the world. And he’s one of the most famous Latin Americans today. And he’s most celebrated novel is an international bestseller the alchemist which has been translated into 80 languages and sold more than 65 million copies. It tells the story of a young shepherd on a spiritual journey to the Egyptian pyramid in search of treasure. You know what? He would be a perfect guest. He would. He would be perfect. I’m sure he would have much to say. And our listeners would certainly learn by him as one of the most famous novelists. Yeah that’s quite a quite a lot of copies out there in the world. And I suspect his journey is creative journey must have been incredible and I’m sure there was great days and I’m sure there were difficult days but he’s really accomplished a lot. I don’t think there’s too many authors out there that have the same. That’s quite yeah. That’s quite a pedigree to have really. Yeah. And you’re exciting. Have you read the book? I have not read the book but now it’s on my list to read because I don’t know how it’s escaped my radar but it has. Well I’ve certainly heard of the book and I did a little research on him like you said for this podcast. But now I want to read that book. Absolutely yeah. So maybe we should start a book club. We can all read it and have a discussion on some social media somewhere. That could be fun. That could be kind of fun. Something to think about. So tell us on the contact page would you like to do that? And let us know. Yeah we just need more work. Yeah we just need more work to do. Okay so now it’s your turn rod. We’re ready for rods motivational moments. Well you know what? I’m going to pick up a little bit from your and mine is it’s best to pursue your dreams by following what your heart desires or what your heart desires most. Isn’t that the truth though if you don’t follow your heart desires you’re usually not really happy you feel frustrated and you want to always get to that point where you can do something you really enjoy. 00:05:03 – 00:10:00 Well as you know we’ve discussed this before and listen to that little still voice within you. And sometimes it’s hard to tune into that voice but it’s well worth it because you discover so many interesting things about what you really feel about what you care about what’s important to you. Those could be good guides as to what you may want to achieve in life. Maybe you want to go to Egypt and find your own treasure. That could be it. That could be it. But I know we live in a world filled with opportunities. So it’s just a matter of identifying the ones that suit you the best. Yes and you know I think that every creative person that a lot of times they don’t like this word necessarily or they don’t want to think of themselves as being entrepreneurs but every creative person is an entrepreneur. As an entrepreneur your responsible for your own game your responsible for creating the business of selling your creativity rather it be art or if you’re a singer a pianist whatever that case may be it’s really important to identify yourself a little bit as an entrepreneur. You’re a business person and there’s been books written about creative people not really embracing or understanding that side of the business but being an entrepreneur be excited. Well also though I think a lot of times creative people that’s the word that they don’t want to hear because they would rather be doing their craft painting singing dancing whatever it may be writing and to sit there and have to market yourself is another whole enchilada. I think that they just go gosh no. I don’t want to do that. I want to do the things I like to do. And unfortunately it comes with the territory. You have to do some marketing. Otherwise people don’t know about you. Yeah they don’t know about you. They certainly can’t. I can’t sell your work. Well you can’t sell it. They can’t see it. They don’t appreciate it. And there’s some pretty incredible people out there that are pursuing their creative life in turning out some wonderful art that people just aren’t even seeing it because people aren’t out there marketing it for lack of a better term. True and you’re not selling out when you do that by the way. Nope. I don’t think that is not a sellout. So yeah and in this day and age you can access information on any topic and use it to channel your thoughts on how you want to succeed in life like understanding the aspect of marketing and letting people know about your creativity. True. And then you know as far as accessing info I love YouTube you can get so much information on there on a variety of things. Sometimes you have to look a little harder because some people’s videos are not very comprehensive. But for the most part you can find out a lot of information on there and also just on the Internet itself. I think when people are afraid to do and become really good at this is doing long tail search terms. You are so good at that. Instead of just tell me about the color black I’ll write two or three cents. Sometimes I’ll write a whole paragraph asking a question and Google loves that. The algorithms seek out every bit of information that you provide at the more information you give them more information return. That’s so true. This could be closer to what you’re actually asking. You won’t have to go through pages before you get to your answers. How do I make it in detail? How do I market my art? But better yet how do I market my creative landscape abstract art? Be specific. I do in California. There you go. That’s really specific. That’s a long tail but they work. Well see I’m learning from you even though I see what you do all the time. But I guess we learned from each other. And our podcast thought wrote podcast is about that by listening to others and how maybe it applies in our lives and how it might shape your life or what you can get out from inspiration and having our own takeaways. Well judging from the feedback we get from our listeners. One thing that always comes across as they go I just learned so much about being creative by listening to what this other person had to say or they say God I could really relate with that person even though they’re entirely on the other side of the world. And maybe doing something entirely different. Entirely different but yet just understanding their creative journey and the things that their trials and tribulations in life and you know we all learn from that and we can learn from other people’s experiences and maybe just maybe hopefully not have to live some of them. 00:10:00 – 00:15:07 Yeah and I think people when they’re express themselves sometimes and they’re telling their life experience it’s not because they’re just so into themselves. It’s really because they want to impart wisdom and not have you go through that crappy experience. And I think it’s they’re trying to be helpful when they do that. They’re very genuine. We’re very thankful to our guests. I mean they’re extremely genuine and very open about what they have to say. Yeah and I think the one thing that we all have to be careful of of course is we can’t model ourselves a 100% off of someone else’s life and we need to stay true to ourselves. You know adapt the information that’s given. But make it work for you. Yeah being true to yourself we look at other people’s successes and we’ll get a little maybe envious or saying I wish I could do that whatever. You should celebrate other people’s successes because you want them to celebrate yours when you have them be happy for others. But also celebrate your own successes even the teeny ones turn out to be major ones as you move forward in your career. And sometimes the teeny ones are just like the preheating to what is great to become. So yeah don’t push that side. It’s just a little of whatever. But you never know where it’s going to lead. Wow Angie. That’s a good point. Yeah. But let’s move on who’s going to be our guest today? Okay well today we’re going to be speaking with Natalie Herrera Pacheco. Herrera. I’m trying. You know I lost the ability to roll my rs and I’m hoping it will come back. I know for some reason it seems to have stuck with me. You know from our initial conversations with Natalie I’m so glad we’re having her as a guest and I might add it’s very interesting to listen to her. You know I was particularly impressed by her philosophy and her creativity and especially her life’s journey. She’s a great guest and I’m so excited that we’re having her on today. Yeah I think you guys are really going to enjoy this. So let’s bring her on now. Yes. Natalie welcome to the thought row podcast. You know we’re always excited to have a guest that has lived their life. So incredibly creatively like you have. Hi Natalie and yes it’s going to be an interesting interview for us. And our listeners to hear your story. Oh thank you so much for inviting me and I’m so happy to be here with you in this wonderful space. Oh thank you. Thank you. Well before we get started with the interview officially we always like to ask our guests what they had for breakfast. So what did you have for breakfast? Well I always have for breakfast exactly the same every single day which is over the meal with some nuts. I have a syrup. I’m on blueberries and coffee probably too much coffee. But every day yeah. Well that’s pretty healthy. That’s pretty healthy for all the way around. That’s my way to give some kind of sense to my day. Yeah well you know what gives you energy a blueberries for your vision. Your vision. So very good. Yeah. Well you know after I want to talk a little bit about your website after engine and I had the opportunity to review your website which I was pretty spectacular. I mean you have a lot of really beautiful. A lot of information on there your background your history and of course a lot of your photographs. You’ve really accomplished quite a bit in your life. But I think we would like to know what was your child a childhood like and when did you first start thinking about photography? Well I did have a very nice childhood. I have to say. And if I want to start with the beginning I’ll say that I am the youngest of four and the different between my brothers and my sister and my two girls and I 9 years. So fun story is that my mom went to the doctor to have. Her tubes tied and she called them because she was pregnant and that was me. I was a mistake. But you were a good mistake see? I think so. So because of by the time ultrasound was not like a big thing. They told her that I was a boy. And surprise again I was a girl. And they didn’t have a name for me. So I was the girl without a name from a long time until they got a name but it was like month without a name. 00:15:09 – 00:20:04 Wow. So. That I think was like a fun story how that. And neither of my parents did art as profession but they were and still are very very creative. And I remember all the time looking at them fixing stuff and my mom creating those that she also did underwear close to sell in order to have some extra money. Right. So I was always behind her chair drawing and he was all creating stuff. And I feel like a great admire them but mostly like my mom doing thing from scratch. That’s something that I was so nice to have in my daily life. That’s so nice. Sure that she’s obviously very creative and you as a young girl. You get to watch all this watch all that and learn and see what she was doing. Tell us more. Yeah. Yeah and I think it was a real privilege to have her every day. And I know that was also for her big sacrifice but she was always there with her eyes on me and in my siblings. So I really know that that was a opportunity. And about photography I started thinking about photography very early in my life because I noticed that my seamless they have a lot more pictures that I have at the time. So that was because of the history also of economic crisis. Like having picture who was very expensive like printing them buy and feeling and my dad didn’t have the money to spend in bad things. So I got the sense of photography and history very early. I wanted the pictures and I wanted my data to take picture of me and I really wanted to talk that wonderful magical object that was the camera. So I started thinking about photos and history like right from I was growing up. See that’s really amazing because it’s just a little thing of having your siblings have photos and you didn’t have as many kind of inspired you to get into photography to achieve and to achieve and to be creative. So that’s really interesting where inspiration comes from. So I also Natalie think it’s very interesting how you came into this world. You were really obvious. It was obvious that you were meant to be here and I think they did a good job picking a name for you. Yeah. It’s a beautiful name. Yeah I love it. It’s a beautiful name. Yeah. So we know that your family is very important to you from the stories you’re just telling us. But you no longer live in Venezuela. It seems like it has created a hardship for you and your family because you can’t be together. But tell us about that. How do you handle that? Well I think that being away from family is something that is natural. It happens to a lot of people. You get a routine is probably in part like gain your space in most of the cases. But I think what is hard allow is not being a way but the impossibility of going back. In this situation it was very interesting for me because I got to connect with people in other places. And build something of empathy what it means to. See your beloved people through a screen. And that you know that you can not toast them that you can not travel and see them in person. So I think right or hug them or even hug them yeah. Yeah see their eyes. So you learn that this is a good moment because you have technology and you find ways to be present but is hard for me and also for them to see our process was becoming older and not being there. So you get really attached to the technology part. So you get you have to be creative. You have to like call see the patio see the birds you have to ask them how are things going? And use these little artifacts and getting involved in the narrative through their metallic voices. And it’s not easy but it’s also an opportunity that we have right now. 00:20:04 – 00:25:03 Well I guess you could be thankful that we do have that technology now because not too many years ago the best you could hope for was a phone call. Yeah. Yeah. Most of the cases yeah. Yeah and that was very expensive too way back in the day. So yeah thank God now it’s a little bit more open and cost effective. Yeah definitely. So it’s a huge change and it makes a difference. Oh yeah definitely it does. So we know you live here in the United States. So how did you end up living in the United States and where did you what did you and where did you study? Well we came here because of my husband in we came at the beginning to mission where he did his masters. And then we started looking for other opportunities. He got to go to his doctor program. So that’s why we ended here and we started like just staying and that was the reason we ended here. And ideas started here but I did my PhD while leaving here. And in Spain so it was my way to keep my head running and kind of keep this like adventure of being in different places at the same time. Sure. Right. Well it looks to me like you know both of your both you and your husband are very well educated and I know that we learn from your website and conversations that we’ve had with you that you hold several degrees and you’ve been educated in other universities outside of the United States. Would you share with us that what was that experience like Natalie coming from Venezuela and then completely to a new environment? So different. Yeah I think that most traumatic thing about it is the construction of otherness like understanding that you are the author. And you start building an identity about it. For example I didn’t know that I was from a country called Venezuela because when you are in your country you’re never used Venezuela. No. I was from my street and I was from my probably from my city and from my state but never from a country and I started telling Venezuela when I got here. So that’s construction of the national identity was probably the biggest effort and I’m still working on it. Like I am the other and I am from that abstract territorial Venezuela. And also it gave me the possibility this situation of living in another country is like a part a deal that you have. So you have yeah the opportunity to create that identity but you have to learn it go because you are embracing other cultures. I like the way that parties meet the poet and writer she wants speaking out New York she said New York for me in New York deformed me. And I think that’s the experience of being a way and with the situation of going to universities you learn you get more content you get education but the living experience that construction is what form you and deform you. I guess. I think that I think you stated that quite beautifully. I did. That’s really beautiful. It’s really beautiful. And that is so true. A lot of times people in the country that they live in and we’ve interviewed people from multiple countries that they don’t necessarily have ever had the opportunity maybe to go study outside of their country. So they’re totally focused on what goes on their daily lives in their country. But you had I guess for lack of a better term you had to immerse yourself in another culture. And if I remember right you had to learn how to speak English is that correct? Yeah. Yeah that was part of the process. I didn’t know even a single word in English like different than high or hello. So it was a. Long process of creating a sentence for thinking about who am I. Like everything like creating everything. Oh yeah I mean you have to think Angie can relate to that because she speaks Turkish and then if she’s thinking in Turkey it’s not like they can English transfer it. 00:25:04 – 00:30:00 Which I’m sure that you when you think in your language it’s much different than you know when you express yourself through English because sometimes the words are not there. Yeah sometimes I feel like it’s like a character. I am not still in the place where I feel natural I think I have to put another skin in order to try to express myself in the way that I think I am in Spanish. But it’s quite different. And you see interesting now. So it’s like being an actor I guess. Yeah. I think that’s a really good analogy. That is. Because it takes out maybe the pressure also of feeling like oh I can’t do this because I don’t know the words. You can just act like you know and it’ll happen for you I like that. Yeah you live the life. Very cool. Yeah I like that a lot. Yeah but I have to say that in this country you are very very patient about. Waiting and giving people time to express ideas. And that helps a lot. Well that’s probably because we speak English but none of us do a very good job of it. So we’re such a mixture of people here. We are a melting pot of people here in the United States where everyone has a different background. Well my grandparents didn’t speak English when they got here. A lot of people don’t speak English when they come here. Yeah. And this is the new land to discover. And learn about it. And learn about it. Yeah. Well I know when we were talking initially Natalie you had spent some time in France and you had some very fun stories. How did that experience shape your creativity? Well the front my experience for us was very interesting to me because I started my reading about Europe through my advice or for my master and she was from la Martinique from the Caribbean island. And she started opening the world for me from the French speaking countries. What shows me when I went to France is that I knew nothing about the world that I was living in a tiny beautiful and really loving place for it put me and spot were discovered that it was more. And that feeling of. Being so overwhelmed by the history of other places opened the doors for like everything to me. And I also could discover the links at least what I could see for myself between the old world. What it means they all world and what it means to be like call me from the new world. And that was so I felt so passionate about it. And these gentlemen philosopher and I’ll try to translate a little bit because I have the Spanish translation but he said something that yeah we can measure. How we know about something. But in what we don’t know we are all equals. And that was I discover in France. That’s very interesting. The thing about is very profound. The interesting thing about Europe is there’s a lot of antiquity there in history even our language even the English language started in Greece and Rome and other areas where the language had transcended all the different countries to where America is definitely relatively young. It’s very young. It doesn’t have the history that Europe has doesn’t have the buildings the architecture the literature the music all of that comes out of Europe. So I can see where when you entered various parts of your perspective France because Francis got a tremendous history I could see for you the way you think and the way you’re educated you must have really enjoyed that immensely. Yeah yeah and all I was in Paris and the aggressiveness of the city was choking and also help me to build also kind of a different character. So I found that I had like my American character. My French character and my Venezuelan one is like living in different personalities all the time. Kind of fun. I assume I assume you bought the appropriate clothes. You could fit to those characters. Yeah yeah yeah it was kind of fun and I learned so much. 00:30:00 – 00:35:05 You know we before we get into discussing your photography which we’re excited to do I’d like you to share with us a little bit about your research on ritual music I thought some of the things you shared with us were very interesting. Well I did during my education. I always try to link what I wanted or let’s say a phenomenon to music because I used to play the tale of for a long time. So I really wanted to keep the music in every part of my life. And I got married to a musician so that’s I would wait to wait. Yeah for sure. But I was interested in this retail coal elris told us because he was in the same region where I was born. And it’s a very interesting ritual because the region is isolated and they kept playing and dancing with this particular flute that goes through as they by kind of a bamboo piece. They also have other flutes that they made with. Deers calls. Oh my goodness. And I’ll show them a so I want that to see if music play an important role or what was the role in music in this community. And what I discovered is that in San Pedro I’m a parody which is a community the important that the importance that you have in the community was related to your ability of playing or the role that you play in the real world. Let’s say the person that played the what they consider the best they can consult that people about life about decisions. They are also the ones that get connected to their gods. So they become the philosophers then. Yeah. Yeah and I saw the medium between that sacred world and their normal life. That’s very interesting. So like a shaman almost at that point. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah and it’s a ripple that is. Let’s say the shape of the Red Bull is male the males are the ones that can play the instruments not women. And it’s a circle readable. So there is a center where they put their divinity some of their Catholic saints but also with different layers of meaning that are related to the indigenous world then the musicians play around this center and then the woman can be around like going in circles like clockwise or the opposite. So that structure of the ritual was also the structure of the social dynamics. The most important people are the one that can connect with that center. And that’s the center of the world. And they use the retail mostly for teal it or asking for things like health like rain like the river to have more water and that was a big opportunity and amazing opportunity for me to start thinking about the role of music in their society but also in our societies. That’s extremely interesting. That is so interesting. Now how did you see yourself connecting with that on a spiritual level? Well because. Happening in the same region where I was born. I feel that that’s part of my life too is part of what the people that was first but to see and do in order to have a better life. And that’s part of who am I. My more remembers like people saying that they were going to the bile a tourist. So I’m connected to that in a historic level but also in a deeper way. Yeah you would be because you would feel the energy from your community and although that were participating in it at all levels. Yeah and it is fun because when I was there and I still don’t have kids but at the time the chief of the retail always said to me oh Natalie you need to have kids. I’ll tell this prayer for you. At least some of them. And I was yeah let’s say let’s do it. Let’s see what happens. He’s being helpful. I like it. So sweet. You know I know that we wanted to talk a little bit about you as a writer. What has been your greatest experience and personal rewards as you write? Writing for me is so important. 00:35:06 – 00:40:13 And I do it because I feel like I need it. And I feel and this sound I know this sounds like very cliche. Well I’m happy really happy. If I get to chair where I write with people I love. So that’s probably the most important thing. If I get my dad to read what I’m writing and if he gets to connect with that world that’s more than happy. I will be more than happy. But also something that happened with writing is that the economy in a way because a sense of freedom in a sense of control. So if I get to reach that level of freedom and control when I’m writing that’s very rewarding. That’s something that I want to keep for me for the rest of my life. I think that’s very special because all too often writers only think about their audience as a large group of people but really if you I know I really feel good when my daughter reads the things I write and I know Angie feels the same because our daughters our daughter knows us so well. She has an opportunity to see how we think and entirely different realm. It’s not like a parent but it’s like a saying things that we feel deeply inside. There were no typically express. So I could see where you’re coming from on that Natalie. That’s pretty special. I really like the analogy of Javier dad read what you have written. I can see where that would be very special to you. Yeah and at the end it’s all about connecting. Absolutely. That’s what matters. If you get to connect I think there are so reasons to continue doing it. Sure. You know you hold several degrees and one of them is an art history. I was curious how that has impacted your creativity. Well you know that I think I didn’t know what it means to go for art history when I started. I knew that I wanted to go something related to humanity but I didn’t know why it means. And I knew about the great desire and this books that show you the genuine of the world but something that impacted me was getting to know Venezuelan artists and Latin American artists because that’s something that doesn’t have that the same impact in publications and magazines and media. So getting to know that you don’t need to be that renaissance genius in order to create that people to create a life and doing it every day around you in your country. In your continent. That was a very powerful thing to experience. And discovering that the dynamics of power that if you have power and country with more money have more power you get your work exposed for in our countries unfortunately we don’t get the same exposure. So again to that point was very important for me in the art history like part of my life. The whole thing about creativity we always say this it doesn’t matter what you do creatively as long as you do something or we think you should do something. The simplest things that you can do making a piece of carving a piece of wood or whatever bring I think a kind of a special energy to your soul and your well-being. So you have the opportunity to see what the artists in your country are doing pretty special because most people don’t ever really get to see that especially at the street level. They really don’t. Yeah and I think that is fortunately changing with social media and with spaces like this one that you have because you get to know people in other places in other spaces in any area but this was before social media. So you get content mainly in classrooms or libraries but right now you have the opportunity to learn in your hand. So I’m so glad that we are getting to this point that you can see like graffiti artists street artists and the discovery that the discovery process I think is faster than it was when I was at the university. Yeah and that’s. Growing exponentially because we have the opportunity to see artists from South America and in fact one of our most famous paintings that both engine I love flaming June is in a museum in South America. 00:40:14 – 00:45:05 So someday we hope to see it in person. So you know so true and nowadays with the way social media is it’s kind of nice because you can have instant exposure within seconds of posting something around the world and influence people and touch people inside. And I think that that’s where social media really shines. Well we wouldn’t be talking to Natalie. No we wouldn’t. We wouldn’t have known you. So this is a cool thing. Yeah very cool thing. Yeah. So with all of your education in your life experiences they seem to lead you to pursue photography. Can you share with us what were some of the challenges you faced especially adapting your educational background to creating with a camera? I think that I didn’t need to adapt my education to the image making process because I think that’s part of who am I or who I am. I don’t know why it’s a correct way there. But I think what I did and I’m still doing my commitment to discovering or learning is something that is there and is linked to all the postal activities that I do in my everyday. But I. Learn about it is that you don’t need to weigh others to define you and what you do. You do and let’s say you build your identity about doing stuff and you don’t need other to tell you well you are a photographer or you are a narrative. If you are taking pictures you are taking pictures and that’s enough you don’t need others to recognize where you are doing. So that’s what I learned and probably what I did but I went through leaving my educational background and taking the pictures. Well you’re smart because the best thing the best photographs are made by people that are actually out there taking pictures. I noticed every photographer has a tendency to photograph a particular subject that they find most rewarding to take photographs of and I’ve noticed that you produce several images street scenes if you will what goes on in your mind when you’re out searching for that perfect photograph that demonstrates humanity if you will. Well when I arrived here something that happened is that I didn’t know English. So the camera became my way to connect to let fear to embrace being brave in a way and what I wanted was going to the streets and get the strength to look people through their eyes and take the photo. And what I wanted was to flow with them kind of dance with the situation me taking the pictures and people in that performance that is going to the street. And probably getting connected to that pretty bearable space that is between you the others and the experience of taking the pictures and creating a reality that will be always circle in a circle there in time and owning you like building a dynamic where you have the power even though you don’t know how to say hi or ask for cheese or they have or a conversation you can always go out and connect with people in that prevail space. So that’s why it’s in my mind and still is in my mind when I try to go out and look for a human interactions. Well you’ve done a very good job of it and people that have the opportunity and will have the opportunity to visit your website. They’re going to see some pretty remarkable images but I also have to say that they are very personal. I can sense what you’re thinking about when you actually take some of those photographs. They’re not what I would consider to be typical street photographs that often show people in misery. Yours are actually for the most part celebrations in life. And I really respect you for that. I want to ask you what do you hope to accomplish in the next two years? You’ve done so much so far. 00:45:06 – 00:50:00 Right. I want to keep breathing and being alive. That’s a good goal. That’s a good goal. And then I would like to keep exploring different ways of seeing and life here with consent is very still. So you have to put some effort to look at things in different ways. So in the next two years probably will be exploring those ways. Looking for ways to get amazed by the same corners or angles or buildings or human activity. That’s where I want. Well, you’ll achieve that I think we are actually already on your way. Yeah, it’s not like being in a super cosmopolitan area like New York or Los Angeles where there’s just so much going on. It’s hard to decide which direction to point your lens. But you’re kind of an area that also has a lot of nature going on. So that’s quite quite beautiful where you are. True. Yeah and as something that is interesting now this place is that you feel the machine that is keeping this country up running every day because you have the factories in you have this utility and buildings that are full of people that are working every day very hard in order to keep these things going. So I love the opportunity to feel that energy and that’s why I would like to see and to learn to see. So that’s really wonderful. That’s wonderful. And my question is going to be what do you want to be most remembered by? This is a difficult one. I know it’s hard. Probably. I like to be remembered that as the crazy cat ladies who know. That’s too sweet. Yeah I love my guts. Well that’s admirable I like that. I’m going to ask you a tough question though in 5 words or less what would be your advice to people that want to live or be more creatively? Now you can have more than 5 words. Okay no pressure. No pressure. Probably I would say open your eyes every day and imagine. That’s really good advice. That’s really good advice. Probably some of the best advice we’ve received. Yeah. Yeah. Okay so now we’re going to ask you the question that we’ve been asking all of our guests which is if you could sit on a park bench in chat with anyone from the past who would it be? Well I think if I could get the opportunity I love to get in a bench conversation. With Nicolas federman he was a German traveler in this 16th century and he went to Venezuela with these dream of discovering to find in Eldorado. Oh yes. Okay. So he got there and he started like these huge mission of traveling and going through the forest. And I would like to get in touch with him and ask him how was it? Especially at the period of time that he was doing it. Yeah in he was in terms of going through and getting those with the indigenous people that was there and the ones that the related to a community that I used to go there. So that would be I think a very fun conversation. I would think so. You know. You’ve been a remarkable guest Natalie and very intelligent. Conversations with you have been just absolutely delightful. I know both engine and I really enjoyed everything. You had to say unfortunately we’re kind of running out of the end of our time but you’re great absolute great. I agree with you rod. And I want to let everyone know if you would like to know more about Natalie. We will have links for her under the show guest tab on thought row podcast dot com so everyone can learn more about her and connect with her on social media. And please check out our website. Yeah it definitely worked looking at that. Thank you so much for this opportunity. And this is amazing and I love being in this space and having the opportunity to have a conversation with amazing people like you. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you to say okay well I guess bye for now. 00:50:02 – 00:50:22 Bye. Thank you so much. Bye bye. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas we shared with you. We post a new podcast every week so remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts so you don’t miss an episode. So it’s by for now from my husband rod and I wishing everyone a great day. Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 35: Mickie Kennedy – PR, Promotion, and Poetry In this episode, we are excited to have as our guest an expert in helping people brand themselves by the effective use of press releases. Mickie Kennedy, Founder of eReleases.com, shares with us strategies on how to get noticed in the media by the effective use of press releases. Mickie not only knows the PR game, but he manages to create and publish his poetry. We were able to get Mickie to read a couple of his poems during the interview. If you are planning on creating some PR for your own creative projects, you will hear from a man that knows the way, but he also knows about living a creative life through his poems.   Show Notes: Episode 35: Mickie Kennedy PR, Promotion, and Poetry 00:00:18 – 00:05:01 You know what? Let’s do a shout-out. Okay, who do you want to shout out? Well, what about those two people that listen to our podcast from Chihuahua Mexico? Yes. That’s the first time, the country of Mexico has appeared on our stats for Life Partners. We have so many other countries that listen but I think them for joining us salute to our new friends in Mexico. And I also want to say I did look up the city of Chihuahua long. They have quite a bit of an art single run down there. So this is very cool. Very cool. Everyone and here we are celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice. I’m Rod Jones and I’m in G Jones. Welcome to the Bots role podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen and we’re available virtually anywhere, you listen to podcasts, no matter what you do creatively. This is the podcast for you. And please tell your friends about the thorough podcast. Well, energy. What are we going to discuss today? Well today, we’re going to be speaking with Mickey Kennedy. He is the owner of a public relations firm and that are experts in press releases. All that’s going to be good. Yeah, you know, I might add that. What made this interview interesting, when it comes to creativity, is often happens to also be an accomplished poet. Yeah. That’s very true. Well, how about your quote? Okay, Ricky your poetry. Yeah, I bet it’s going to work with poetry. It is going to work with poetry. So, here’s the quote for this week concave a bid is Yin. And that is by TS Eliot. You know, what I’ve noticed about quotes from poets, their quotes, always seem to be like, they really hit the mark and I have to admit, I don’t I have to read a poem numerous times before I really grasped, but I don’t usually get it first time unless it’s pretty simple, right? I know, when I read your poetry. I’ll tell you that. I’ll say, you know, I have need to read this a couple of times, but then once it finally sinks in, then I really get it. Yeah, and I think a lot of people feel that way about poetry. But what’s interesting about poetry and I think this probably is true for most people is you, you will have a lot of feelings when you read them, but you can’t really wage. Your finger on it and then you’ll start to feel like you’re getting images and and, and understanding of it and it kind of has to develop and it’s not one of those things that not not all the time is Thursday, just obvious like a like a story necessarily probably a lot of that has to do at least, I think in this way, I interpret them is the words the vocabulary. Sometimes they’re very easy with our e, very sentimental. A lot of times, you know, the word love is involved. It makes you become more passionate about what you’re reading even though you don’t necessarily understand what is communicating to you. But this quote appears by TS Eliot, that’s pretty interesting. And I can, I can relate. I know I don’t always get it. I first went to that may be probably because I’m not real good at writing. Poetry. You have that gift in this household, not me. I mean I think that you do if you if you really want to develop it, I guess so, well, it’s where your interests are. That’s probably true. Yeah. Okay. So now it’s your turn Rod. We are ready for rods, motivational factor. For some reason. I thought you were going to ask me what we had for breakfast. No, but you probably would know because I believe you’re the one who fixed it honestly, and the one that gobbled it down home. Well, my motivational thought is every human being on the planet, has same twenty-four hours a day. It makes a lot of sense to use those hours wisely else. There couldn’t be a truer statement because we have the same hours 24 hours. Every single person as Nikolai Tesla. Oh good choice and he he accomplished so much. When was it we heard they had 80 trunk Falls of ideas that were locked away inventions and ideas inventions and ideas. And so if he can log, So, can you? Yeah, and, you know, obviously, you need to give yourself some time to sleep eight hours. But that leaves, how many hours to be creative. 00:05:01 – 00:10:04 I don’t know. Math is not worried. I don’t know. What is it sixteen or something like that? Probably sixteen. But just think what you can do the 16 hours. Yeah, you can you can achieve a lot. I mean, a most really successful people use those hours and unfortunately, sometimes more. They should get to get a good night’s sleep, which is critical to your thinking and being creative and being Innovative. So sleep is a big issue. It is and also using time to think and that is the one thing that some of the great thinkers of the world will set aside time to read. And also think so you need to set aside time to reflect and also read and learn. Yeah. I like to put on a headset and listen to classical music juice. And sometimes it puts me to sleep but it’s a very restful sleep, but more often than not, I just really, really good ideas. Thoughts come into my head and I really appreciate that time. It’s it’s some of the most relaxing time than I spend. I really should try to do it more often, but it’s really important. So yeah, you know, every single person of the planets, got 25 1/2 hours a day. You’re going to sleep some of it, but try to make the best out of every hour. You can make it, make it productive or make it healthy for yourself, right? Okay. I’m now I wash pick up on something, your sister and her husband said this morning when we were talking to them on the phone and that was about our podcast featuring creative people. Yeah, that was somewhat revealing because as we’ve mentioned before we celebrate what people love to do creatively, but that doesn’t necessarily mean. We only chat with artists and the like we think everybody is created in something dead. That’s so true. And you know what? Creativity is just not for people in the Arts. Like it can involve you can be creative as an athlete. You can be creative in bed. Yeah, like cooking, you can be creative and well, of course, crafting, which I have zero talent in that area for some reason. But, you know, you know, there’s so many different ways that you can be creative and even like our guests that he he has a, a press release company that, you know, he’s very good about crafting different kinds of press releases for p which requires creativity very much so very much. So yeah, I mean, business people can be very creative and they develop and come up with different kinds of products and took all the way back to showing. Like you said, Quilters, filters sewing or people that just invent things. Yeah. This is kashay. Speaking to my brother-in-law, who was on the call log. He makes Furniture beautiful Furniture. He’s got a nice Workshop that’s associated with their house. And I know he takes advantage of the hours. He has of the day to go out there and build things, and they’re really quite spectacular. And the thing about being creative that I’ve noticed, and I think that anyone who gets into their creativity, whatever it may be, is that it brings you a sense of incredible satisfaction and incredible accomplishment and a peaceful feeling and it gets rid of the anxiety in your life. So if you, if you keep making excuses and putting things in front of your creativity that you would like to get into or a lot more time to, you’ll find that you’re going to feel a lot better by yourself. Your life. You’re going to have more patience and things and everyone tolerant and have energy excitement. Yeah, and a sense of accomplishment, rather your name. And something with your hands, which is really kind of nice or if you’re just crafting, a poem that you’re riding out true. And if you can write it out longhand, I think that’s kind of a nice thing to, you know, they say that I’ve read about that, that if you’re right, or it’s really good to write out things longhand, at least, periodically, I mean, everybody’s using a computer. But it’s really important to not lose your skill of writing out things longhand because it’s very tactical and you get feedback in it. I don’t completely understand what that’s all about. But I’ve been reading about it and it’s pretty amazing. The fact that that your whole body gets when you write not just your hand is pretty interesting. So true and you know, I I think that if you feel like you’re not even creative in the tiniest bit off, I think a great way to be creative is to have a journal, make yourself a journal. In fact, we have one on our website that was by Angelina. Guess so, we had It’s a junk journal and it’s a work of art that she made. But if you just want to write in a journal, you can certainly purchase one. And then also, we were discussing about putting a journal that she can write in on our website. 00:10:04 – 00:15:06 At. Rowe podcast,. Yeah, so you can, yeah, we’re going to be having that pretty soon. So stay tuned for that. We’re really excited about it. And that way, it will help promote creativity in your life. Every morning. When you sit down, and you have your coffee tea, or whatever, you can write down in your journal, what your thoughts are for the day. And I wash also make a comment about artists. I know that artists myself included like to hear what other artists have to say. But you know, we’ve learned that you can discover so much about people that are living creatively and from people that are not in the traditional world of creative. Yeah, and create a playlist artists log. Jurors, so true. I mean, people that share their creative passion, no matter what their medium or for that matter what their occupation is seem to provide insights off that are inspirational to anyone wanting to live creatively. I know that when we get feedback on the various people that we had on the podcast, people will say to us, you know, I really enjoyed that episode and I never really thought about this or I never really thought about that or that person’s life experience is similar to mine, you know, not everybody has a Rosy life and they have wage to overcome or deal with certain things that have happened in their life that may have slowed, their creative process down, but we all learn by what other people have to say. It’s just been, it’s been very rewarding and it’s been rewarding for me. And I’m pretty sure it has been for you to n, g. I, I have to say that, you know, you may not want to hear what a guy talks wage. Regarding press releases or you may not want to hear what an opera singer has to say. But trust me, they have a lot of interesting things to say that will benefit your own life of being a creative person, you know, the comments that I’ve heard from different people that we’ve talked to is cycle. You know, I really didn’t know that, I would be interested in that. And once I started listening, it was like, oh, their life is so interesting and and I learned from this incident that they talked about in their life or this experience. So, it’s very you, you learn through communication with one another and you learn through other people’s the way they they deal with their trials in life and point. Any of the other thing I want to point out is saying how we interview people from all over the world and shove cultures. It’s really kind of special to hear their take specifically from their country. True, you know, world’s one of our the most recent one that wage. Interviewed with somebody from India and it just asking her what she had for breakfast. That was fascinating. It was fascinating and I wanted to try it immediately. Sounded really good. I know people think oh, they’re going to have that signature question or what do they have for breakfast? But we do for two reasons. Yes, we do for two reasons. One. We’re always looking for something interesting to happen right away. But the second part of that is, is it lets people have an idea of what somebody in another country is doing people from was at Sweden or other places. They have real interesting breakfast. I mean, they’re not the Southern California, bacon and eggs kind of breakfast by any stretch. Very different country by country is very different. Well, speaking of creative occupations Palm Spring on Mickey Kennedy e releases.com. Mickey, welcome to the Thoreau podcast. It’s going to be really good to speak with you today. Yes, it is. Hi Mickey. It’s good to chat with you today. I am so happy to be here. Good to have you here. And you’re calling us were talking to you from. Where are you? I’m in Baltimore County, Maryland. Oh, nice. Nice, very pretty. You know what? I’m telling people, Mickey to share with our listeners, how we found out about, you both inch, and I’ve written numerous press releases over the years and I thought I would do a little research on public relations companies. So I Googled that of course and your company ereleases popped up and after reviewing your company website and watching your video, which was really good. It was good. I discovered two things about you. You have a great PR Company, but also that you are a published poet. I found that very interesting. Yeah. Wow. I also want to add, I want to congratulate you on having excellent SEO because you came in on the top of the pile, which is a big thing these days. 00:15:06 – 00:20:03 There’s so much SE especially in that category. Right? Right, and it’s so interesting that so many talented, people that we’ve talked to manage their own, you know, companies. They also are very creative in some form, of course, cuz they’re creative people and I know they would be interested in learning how they can get more press coverage. And what do you think about that Mickey? Or you think about your landing on top of the SEO, as? Well? I think it’s an important aspect of the business. I think it helps that we’ve been in business for over twenty two years. So there’s, you know, a lot of content and a lot of people linking towards over the years and see us, it’s Authority. But, you know, at the end of the day,, we’re still fighting to get people’s attention. That press releases exist in the pr or something that a small business and entrepreneur a speaker and author, any of those people could afford and down payment. Yeah. It seems like a really good way to go really anybody that wants to let the world know that they’re alive and well and exist, right? And also I think our conversation today might help clarify, you know, what what is is about? So as a creative you will feel more comfortable, may be engaging, someone that could do that for you understanding, right? But before we move on Main, We always like to ask are guess what they had for breakfast. So what did you have this morning? I had some macadamias and that’s it. Just some Macadamia is Faith. Brought back from Hawaii and they were really good done in that great little. Can that they all seemed to come in there. So good though. Luke and I think we think we caught one once. Yeah, I think so too. That’s a good breakfast. That’s protein and that protein it’s good for you. Yeah, right. Very happy. My understanding is that the Macadamia is really high in a mega threes. As far as Jobs go. That’s a really healthy fat. Oh, yeah, it would be good for your brain. Also. Yeah. Yeah. So let’s start with what we all want to know. Is how did you get into the public relations business? Right. So I guess around 25 years ago. I was working for a telecom, start up and I was finishing up grad school at the time, and I think that I’d already done a class instead, just needed to work, my thesis submit it, but one of the things that I did is employee number three was p r, as well as marketing, and sales and the pr component was off, as taxing press releases and because we were publishing numbers and statistics a lot of journalists started to call and say, could you just email that to me so I could copy and paste it and that’s life. Bulb went off that, you know, email us so much Superior to faxing and I I mentioned it to my boss and he said you should chart a business and I spent about a year contacting journalists. And when I launched a year later I had about almost ten thousand journalists who had said. Yes, and I could send in press releases on various different subjects. Wow, that’s true. Take you had such good response, right? And then over the years, PR newswire reached out to us and said, hey, you should also send your releases through us and I pointed out that their average rate for national press releases, $1,000. And my clients are paying at the time a couple of hundred dollars, and it just would be out of their budget. And we eventually came to a win-win situation where I started schedule our releases for the next business day. So that their editorial staff, that is in place overnight, which, you know, Unfortunately, they don’t do very much, but you have to be there. They gave them something to do. So, there’s no additional labor for them. So we did try to carve it out to be a win-win between the two. So all of our releases now, go out nationally over PR newswire as well as to what the email distribution that we still have your email distribution. If I remember, right, is pretty substantial it, is we no longer house our own. No. Database. We do rely on the decision database that we have, and we did put our journalists in there. So we are still reaching them. But it just through that our plan form. Oh great. Well, then you should maximum. I’m guessing that gives you maximum coverage throughout this country and what I’m going to ask you this question, kind of getting a little ahead of ourselves a tiny bit, but I did want to ask this question before. I forget what about International? I know some of our listeners are creative people in there in all parts of the world. So maybe just quickly you could address the potential for generating internationally, right? So we do send internationally mostly the email distribution rather than the wire internationally. 00:20:03 – 00:25:03 It, it’s not our strength wage are really good at u s National and including the wire but when it comes to International we don’t get as much of a call for it. So it’s just something that we have available through the email this page. Vision, but it is fairly limited. Okay. Well, that’s good answer. It’s good to know. I was wondering, could you tell us what the biggest advantage of sending out? Press releases are the biggest Advantage is leverage. So for example, last year during the pandemic, we did a press release for a dining Bond initiative, that a small PR firm was leading and putting out. And we just did one, press release, and we sent it out, and the response was just overwhelming, 150, + places, picked it up the Wall Street Journal, Washington, Post, New York Times. All the food magazines and trade Publications. Picked it up. It was a newspapers. It went International and, and did very well internationally and it was dead. Millions of dollars. In Revenue was created through that. That went to local restaurants that were closed and gave them some Revenue at a time where they didn’t have any, and it was a very positive way. People could help their local restaurants that invite them to participate in it. And so, you know, it was a very short-lived thing but it was a very positive thing and a negative time and it was just a perfect storm and millions of dollars. In Revenue were created at a cost that would have been like two to three hundred dollars to send out through us. I did it for free. And as a courtesy, the pr firm, and it seemed like a really good but, you know, that kind of Leverage, you can’t get anywhere else. I mean, you can create a really good Google ad, but you can’t put $200 into it and get millions of dollars out. It just doesn’t happen. But that element of Leverage is one of the things for PR works extremely well, so that’s an extreme example, but it’s not unusual for people to do with Iraq campaign of 428, press releases and, you know, have spent under $3,000 and come back to us and say, Hey, you know, some of these press releases wage Do well, some of them did all the other week and determine that we generated, you know, sixty thousand dollars eighty thousand dollars. And the great thing about it is the the revenue generally continues to come back up these articles live on their, on other websites. And you know, the traffic will just continue to be there. And in addition to that, you can leverage it yourself. You can share. If you get a break in the New York Times, you could share that with your own Community, your customers, your social media. So it’s a great way to show that there’s been credibility created and that was almost an implied endorsement. But, you know, this news Outlet picked you to write an article about. Yeah, it remains Evergreen and never goes away at that point. You’d like to I’d like to congratulate you on doing such a wonderful thing for all those restaurants. I mean, we all know that it’s been very challenging for just about everybody birth. Restaurants, were hit particularly hard and the program that you put together. I mean, that’s, that’s incredible, fabulous. So wonderful. Well, I guess, you know, most every company for that matter individual artists can benefit from having a well-written press release and having a distributed properly written thoughts on that wage. I know you kind of touched on that but tell us more about that, right? So I am going to just to say that I feel a well-written, press release is a lot less important than a, well, strategic press release, and I’ve changed quite a bit. I wrote, I think eight to ten years ago, a book on writing press releases and I really believe that writing the most perfect choice released was the way to get success in. What I’ve determined is it’s not I do press releases every single day for clients that do nothing. They get no media,. I would say that’s probably the majority of their press releases that we do and and then I have customers who repeatedly get media coverage all the time and the difference isn’t dead. How well-written the press releases? It’s how strategic the press releases. For example. I have a client that just does surveys and studies because they represent lots of different Industries. They can do a study on each industry and a lot of them lately have been. How have you been to addressing? Post-pandemic? How do you see yourself transitioning? Will you be coming back to work? What does your marketing budget look like going forward? All this data within an industry is really important and people really liked it. 00:25:03 – 00:30:11 And so they do Thursday. Well, almost every press release that they do based on a survey or study generally gets between eight and fourteen articles written about them. And those are unique articles. It’s not the press release replicated on a bunch of websites, which does happen. Every time I press releases issued. But you know, these are meaningful articles that get out there to create links and traffic and you know, our huge credibility indicators to age. A particular website. And that’s what can happen with the Strategic press release. Unfortunately, a lot of the press releases I get is, you know, and has now gone from an associate director of HR to an assistant or, you know, you know, Master director, or executive director or managing director of some department. And it’s really not that took out of sight side. Maybe a couple of trade Publications in a newspaper. So I would say just email it directly to those three places and save yourself the money. If you’re going to send something over a wire and through a service like ours, really try to, you know, present yourself with the most newsworthy announcement you can do and so many people get tripped up that they just say, well I’m not newsworthy. And the example of the survey and studies is one that I have put together in some training that I have. And I’ve actually worked with local auto repair shop in New Jersey. Pennsylvania was looking to get links from Auto industry trades. They’re not important. They, they’re, they are not pillars of the automotive industry. They’re just one local auto trade shop. And what they did was, they put together a survey with some advice for me. And one of the questions that they asked, was, what’s the strangest thing? Someone left in their car, while being repaired there was just an open field where people just put stuff and they didn’t know who to send it to because they don’t know other auto repair shops. So I suggested that they reach out to a small trade Association, which they did Association life, depended, auto, repair centers, and they sent it out to their members about eight hundred of them, filled out the survey. I think having the trade Association mentioned in the press release was a win-win situation because these small trade associations. Don’t get a lot of love and attention. It was a gross way to mention them. And it also adds credibility to you that, you know, you did this survey and partnership with them. They got over. And Auto industry trade Publications writing articles about the survey. They got lots of newspapers including their local newspaper, picked it up and we weren’t actually sure they would work in the General market, but it did and it was a huge success. They were looking for links to a new website. They had put up because they’re old website was tied to the Yellow Pages was a free page. So they were hosting, I don’t know if it ended or whether they’re marketing with the Yellow Pages ended. But at some point, their website went down, they had to create a new domain, a new website, and they just were thinking. And then just a few weeks. They were ranking in their area as number one based on, you know, the fact that in the automotive industry, having a lot of Auto industry trade Publications, linking to you as soon as credibility indicator, so they just Rose to the top and that to me that, you know, that’s kind of a tough category to come up with a strategy like you did wrong. Photo industry is, I mean, it’s hard to make things really interesting there. I mean, everybody knows they need to have their car fixed and that’s about as far as they think about it. I don’t want to put you on the spot here. Brad tap into your expertise a little bit. How do you think you would crap or an idea on how you would craft a survey? That would be applicable to an artist to write down a poet, which will discuss in a little bit, I would say, is there a way that you could get ask some questions that would be relevant for them to community. So if you’re an artist, you know, how are other artists right now? Can you take their temperature, where they are right now? How was the pandemic? How did it affect your monthly hood? Has you know how, you know, is what you’re doing, changed? Because of it. Are you making more and you’re making less what are the, you know, types of of things wage? You’re utilizing. You want to, you know, ask some questions or really specific to you, but I think that so many people would be interested in this other artists communities artists, black artists trade Publications. That might exist newspapers that have art sections. A lot of them would find it. Very interesting to see how, you know, artists are doing right now and how their faith coped with the pandemic and what they see going forward. You know, what, what’s their Outlook is it positive? Is it negative? And I think that right now is a really good time for a lot of people in a lot of different age, you know, groups, like authors writers, things like that to put together a survey and send it out again. 00:30:11 – 00:35:11 You don’t have to know the people you can you know reach out to a great blog or a trade Association. Just somebody that has a community of people that would be really good to you know, send out a link to your survey and get them to participate and then it’s a really a great idea and there’s a large dog. Ways to attract lists and there are artists associations have just about every genre. You can think of how would you tie that or would you even tie that back to say a press release? What the process is announced the survey? Yes. Yes, that’s correct. And and that’s what we do in our cases. We talked about the survey that we did. You name, Wilson specifics and how large the survey was. We usually linked to a page where all the results are published because generally you might ask forty fifty questions in a survey and you can’t really give all of them attention to press release but focus on a couple of the, the really interesting questions and you can actually have a really great quote as well. So let’s say we found out that people and, you know, the visual arts gifted what they’re creating an or relying more on, let’s say online prints rather than originals and you know, then you could have a quote saying you know what, I what I believe this wage. Means is that, you know, people are becoming more comfortable interacting with people virtually and also, you know, approaching art virtually as well. And and you can have a really nice quote and it would be you as a fellow artist in there. And again, you could focus on a couple of the really cool questions that are in there. I always say, throw a quirky question or two in there. The one I mentioned with the Auto industry was the strangest things people left in the cars. That was what were Byron almost 95% because we could see yes, so interesting topic. Yeah, 95% of the coverage was the stories because almost everything they got left was a story. A boa constrictor that I left. My grandma was left in an urn and they needed to retrieve it so that they could have a memorial service in the midst of a repair. So, there was this large, a little strange things that people have done over the years and that was what peacock. Resonated with and so always try to come up with some really solid questions and, you know, maybe even take the Pulse of others. And say what would you like to know what’s going on right now with your struggles right now on the artist Community. Maybe we can get some opinions out there on it or some suggestions and things like that as well. So I think that’s great. I I really like girls attitude to it’s so funny to hear all the people who are raising things like that, you know, people people love stories. They love anything that sort of is entertaining and not if you understand that while you want to get media coverage for you. The journalist is actually a gatekeeper and deciding what content will be of interest to his audience. And so anything you can do to increase the likelihood that the audience would find. It engaging interesting titillating that’s going to do really well. And you know, if you can approach it from birth, Standpoint, it can work really well for you. So many people are just like I just want to get, you know, sell product X. I just want to announce product X and there’s really nothing that’s interesting or compelling to share what readers, you know, it’s almost like the the journalist sees those types of press. Releases says, just by an ad, you know, there’s nothing here for me to create a to create an article. Exactly. Exactly. You’re making them have to work pretty hard and they’re not and they’re getting tons of these things that are handed to them almost daily. Right? Right, right. Okay. So what is the biggest misconception about writing a press release? I think that some I think the biggest hang-up is so many people, just discount PR and just say I’m not wealthy enough. I’m not important enough to remove for to utilize PR. And the Really thing is that the people who often have the most success are the ones that are the small pack. They are completely authentic and upfront about who they are and where they are, and they’re chapter of their business. We had a client that was looking to get their story out. And he told me that they had just spent their Thanksgiving instead of eating turkey and everything like normal with a few friends and their dining putting together packages and, you know, working out of their garage as well to try to get ready for all of the orders that they had had because a lot of their stuff was geared up to before Christmas holiday and that was six years. 00:35:11 – 00:40:06 To them. And they, they were, you know, they mentioned it. Just and I said, I think that’s the story we should run with and they were embarrassed like I wouldn’t want other people to know that and I said, no, that’s the toughest or out for a few people resonate with. They find it authentic. It’s a struggle. It’s an obstacle. Everybody has growing pains and they got picked up by Inked magazine that it resumes did so, well that they got several business newspapers and magazines picked them up. But ink was the big one. And, you know, you know, just because you’re small just because you do all your important doesn’t mean that you’re not, you don’t have something that’s worthy of sharing with the world. Well, yeah, I’m sorry. That was just very entrepreneurial. I mean off your phone or in the world. They could remotes can relate to that. And they would find that I think that’s why ink and people like that picked it up because they know that that’s a more typical. That happens, more wage. Quickly than one would think? I mean, I know we’ve worked on holidays with family and everything else. I’m sure there’s probably lots of people have done that. Also. I think that so many of these corporations started out kind of in that same boat in the garage and the garage or in the back room or you know doing it over dinner. There’s just you know, you you as an entrepreneur you start somewhere. Yeah, Mickey Mouse is really good, really good thing. And another thing is journalists often like undiscovered Little Gems. They like to be seen as curators and you’re generally not going to curate a giant multi-billion-dollar company is going to be a small undiscovered, you know, start up or Indiegogo or Kickstarter or something like that. And that’s why a lot of those do really well with p r and it’s been a journalist and say, hey, this is kind of interesting and I think my audience would find it engaging. So let me write an article about it. Oh, yeah, see I can see that. Yeah, I’ve noticed that your company crafts, press releases. In fact, you talk about that on your website, pretty extensively, and it was really informative page. Any experience in writing, press releases that are applicable to people that are in the art world. I know you do corporations and I know you first start ups, but what about people, specifically, artistic people, artistic people? Yeah, we had, we had an an artist who’s in class artists. I think she was in the Washington DC area. And she did a few press releases with us. Were we wrote the press releases for her and we accompanied it with the photos of this amazing glass work. A lot of her stuff, gets sucked up for commercial use like a hotel or a signature piece, a corporate building, or something like that, and she did really with getting picked up in service. Magazines. And, you know, they did a really large spotlights of her and ask for many more pictures that they can include and, you know, that, that was one person did extremely well. I think that so many people forget, you know, multimedia is important. So if you have a video and you’re an artist or you have really good pictures, they don’t have to be like a professional pictures, but just really good pictures you want to include those when you send your release out because a lot of people will look at those and if it’s something that’s really, you know, interesting they’ll definitely you know seek you out and want to know more about your story and it is about this story and especially our room cuz they’re so visually absolutely loved it is, you know, you know what, I think it’s really interesting when you see the artists and their environment, because I know that when I look at pictures, I like to see what’s in their Studio. I like to see YouTube How they paint, where they create, where they create, what what they’re, you know, environment is and I think it’s like you said, it doesn’t have to be a formal picture. I think the the informal candid pictures far more interesting and then something that’s overly stage. Right? Right. Leads us to your debts. Question related to someone and creativity. Yeah. I wanted to ask you about your poetry. That was one of the reasons we felt that you would be an excellent guest. On. Rowe podcast, is because you write poetry. Has that been a lifelong passion for years. It has, it’s something that I’ve always done. And then I went to graduate school and get an MFA in creative writing with an emphasis in poetry. So I really went down, well, deep. And I felt like I learned how to write and to communicate and to emotionally sort of travel through words, and I think it helped me off. 00:40:06 – 00:45:01 Career-wise. I mean I also think that, you know, some of the times new coming up with surveys and perky survey questions comes out of my creative mind because I sort of think of outside edge of predictable thought and what would be really interesting. And, you know, you know, what’s a crazy question. You could ask someone in any field that would probably elicit some really strange and often entertaining answers. See, that’s really good. Very good. Yeah. So, okay. This can lead me to ask you. Can you please read one of your poems today for us? I’m sure. Okay. So this one is called perfect recall. Are there cheers for the poet? Who stops writing a grieving? Four. Stanzas that now cease to be written the images and stories of a small town in Western Maryland. Still the trains run mostly in one time, and the commuters have begun the return to normal an old woman sets, her garbage can by the street on account of rain. And the fact, she can’t be trusted to remember to do it before. Going to sleep. A child stops at the old train museum and finds the front door. Slightly open an old man carrying a box. Removing house keys from the lock. She convinces him to let her Peak up. The stairs were in a room off to the right tracks and Countryside Meander over. Felt-covered plywood, do these few moments even exist at the poet, stops recording them? Perhaps a girl will grow up and tell the story where she was the Lone visitor in the museum. No ticket required as the man flipped switches off. Trains came to life. She says, she recognized one of the plastic children in a diorama of a park. It was her daughter Katelyn. Then. Not yet born, and she only takes this moment. Now, sometime in the future to share, she comes and close for a laugh and a hug. That’s beautiful. Very, very under flipping off or reading that for us today. It’s really interesting because you’re, you know, you’re in the business of public relations and then so for us to say that you’re also a poet. Well what you just did is you clearly proved that. You’re an excellent poet, an outstanding. So, I don’t know if I want you to write a press release, write a poem poem press release when I don’t know, but let me go. See that was, that was pretty spectacular. We both the engine. I’ve read a lot of poetry, but I, and I could really relate to that one. There’s a lot of relais De Both things that you mentioned in that, you painted a really wonderful pitcher. Yeah, when you words, tell a story and a poem, that’s really a very odd visual thing without being visual. Yeah. That’s really good. Yeah. Thank you. I know you’ve published a book on poetry, and I think you have a couple of others in the works. Could you show us about them? Yeah, so I I have a book forthcoming. I think, with the pandemic, the Publishers, you know, hasn’t given us a date cuz it was supposed to been out by now, but it’s out of jail. And I have a couple of other books that I’ve completed. I haven’t started sending them out because I kind of wanted to wait for the first book to, you know, get out there before I started sending subsequent books, but I would still write. I write quite a bit. I have, oh, during the pandemic, you know, last year and half I probably written close to two hundred and fifty, poems home. And it’s just something that I do these little challenges where I decide after a break that I’m going to try to write something every single day. It may end up being a finished home. It may just end up being bit thousand pieces of a palm, you know, one day it might be a revision of a poem that I already written, but I try to actively, right each day. I feel like I can keep that month. I’m going for about 30 days and then I feel, I need a rest. And so I write for thirty days. I take a little time off. I might do some editing during that time. And then, you know, whether it’s about a month or two months, then I get right back into it and do another 30-day Marathon. That’s so wonderful. Okay, when it comes to writing many people consider poetry page being one of the more difficult things to achieve creatively. What are your thoughts on them? I don’t know. I think that everybody as a young person has written a poem and still has that in them. And I think that there’s something that wasn’t fostered and appreciated at that time to make them comfortable, still doing that thing in life. 00:45:01 – 00:50:01 I think that so many people have beautiful words that they can put together and you know, sometimes it’s just a line or two, but I think that the potential is there and I I home That poetry will play a bigger part in our education and in society, you know, going forward cuz there’s a lot of amazing perspectives out there that are being represented palm tree, but there’s not a lot of readers. I think there’s a lot more poets than there are readers of boats. Yeah, true. That’s unfortunately. Yeah, I’m going to kind of skip this next question is because I think our listeners and I know Angie and I want you to share Mikey Mike and other Mickey Mickey. I’m sorry the other one of your okay, so this one’s a little different. It’s called Junk Drawer, a bridge, a brick, a broom, an anchor on the end of a balloon hansom cab where the horse wears, an ugly face to work with the chalky sliver of a quarter moon, a stolen car contemplates, Ford Center blocks for shoes as it adjusts. Its wipers, the star fruit at the special wage. Market goes unsold, an igloo with a new pair of wool socks, a surge of surf after the offshore Quake Sirens, Warren up tidal waves done on this time. Just a crab that hovers over sand and puts away a seagull rides. A sleep of wind white body against a stray. Blur of Sky below. A cat is held for the first time losing its Barrel ways. With each cuddle, an office coffee pot left on a warm, The Empty Glass carafe kisses until the office manager starts or fresh pot off the league of registered voters. There are no superheroes, just a group of concerned, volunteers searching for something more, a high school, football coach buys a buffalo suit two southbounders. Too big because his son will be a freshman in two years. Karma is a fast-food, apple pie a car phone charger with a short the chipped base you turn around and go home. Flowers, the sidesaddle approach a breaking, a cult fear is the Frog along, the Pond View Place into a burlap bag. The electric bill you find in last month’s magazine, offer a crate where your grandmother kept old rags, The Piano Master toils. On an old upright, while Rich amateurs by baby Grands. The would-be writer reads, another nod respects, the fact, there’s little left to understand a landfill. Awaits, another man’s Treasures. The knock and the door sound equally Hollow. Wow, I you know, our you’ve read too incredible pieces are things both included in the book and the network and the new book know, these are very recent jumped where I wrote in June and the perfect recall. I wrote just this month. So they’re, they’re just too fairly new pieces. I picked up, you have your shop. The powering houses are first, you know, earlier you mentioned job. About how when people maybe, when they were younger, had the Poetry Gene in them or the vibe and I wonder with you was there one special person that was a mentor to you. I think there were several. I think I had a great middle school teacher that encouraged me to write. I remember in high school. I had another teacher that really encouraged me off, right? Felt like something was there and then later in college. I had many great teachers that fostered the writing and I did a lot of creative writing as an undergraduate and then in graduate school, you know, some really great teachers. They’re Carolyn forche a was one of the more well-known poets that I worked with and you know, they they helped Foster this, you know with growth of me as a writer and really gave me the structure and the discipline to to continue to write explore what it is to be a bulb. Okay, that’s a pretty solid background and inspirational to. I’m going to put you a little bit on the spot again, this one in less than five. Words, what would you tell people that want to live more creatively? You could be flexible on the pipeworks, right? I would say commit to discipline. I think a lot of people whether they’re artists visual artist. I know someone who works with oil paints. I know someone here, you know, I know a lot of creative people because of my background and who I am and you know, have have experienced what they’re the years. And it’s funny because over the years some of my artist friends have stopped. 00:50:01 – 00:55:14 They’ve stopped producing and I think that there’s it’s it’s like a muscle that you have to exercise with discipline and really commit to it because it’s so easy. Once you get married and have kids to just say, I don’t have time for us anymore. So easy to say this is one thing that I just have to put on the back burner and not focus on me, and the the reality of it is if you watch wage New TV in your life. You have the time to, you know, do something else life. Other than watching TV. It could be writing. You’ve just made a choice not to so I can pull up the discipline to trade some of that time that you might spend on Tik-Tok or social media or watching TV and get back into your Chrome and spend some time there exploring. And it’s fun, how I used to rate twenty-five, thirty years ago is is really different than how I right. Now. There was a time in there that I got rid of experimental and was influenced by language poets and the junk drawer is very reminiscent of that where it’s not narrative and it’s month or image-based but you really don’t know what you’re doing other than sort of Surfing through lots of images and observations and things like that, but the language stuff wasn’t very accessible. And I’ve gone back to narrative in recent years. And I find that really refreshing because I think it also has parallels with PR people really resonate with stories. Wage is the G. Right? No one resonated with my experimental. Poetry. I enjoyed it. It was a time that I explored language and played with stuff but nobody who’ve read it wrong appreciated, it more than me. And so now I write for others and I just filled my work is a lot more fulfilling because of that, many of the people we’ve interviewed. One of the things about pursuing, any form of creativity, even if it’s, you know, baking a great cake, is it relieves anxiety? And there’s no shortage of anxiety going around. So if you like I said, take some time away from television or other maybe menial tasks. I mean, even if you’re vacuuming your house, you can think about something creative. Well, you know, the interesting thing about birth Mickey sad. And what you’re saying, Rod is that so many times we go in front of the T to relieve anxiety and it only works up to maybe a teeny weeny, but when you actually are doing something creative and you can see, you know, the result of your labor, labor tends to make you feel satisfied and less anxiety, you know, life. Like you have a satisfaction that that brings about a calmness I think are true. And even in writing poetry. Even if you’re having a hard time, coupling words together, just the mere exercise choice of doing that releases anxiety and it gives your brain a way to focus that. It doesn’t know. You’re just being stagnant, you know, watching T all the time. Yeah. Me too. You bomber run a lot with your poetry. Yeah. In the different, iterations are very like the experimental poetry because then it makes you, you know, think on a different level, right? So very cool. Okay. So now we’re going to ask you a question that we asked all of our guests and that is, if you could sit on a park bench in chat with anyone from the Past, who would it be? Let’s see. I’m not 100% certain. I can easily pick one person. I would love to talk with Shakespeare. I would love to talk to people who were like, great leaders in the past. There’s, there’s, there’s so many people, but to be a long bench. I mean, you don’t have temperature pinch. Yeah, right. It could be a snack bench and you have a whole bunch of people in there, right back to take some deep breaths. Shakespeare obviously to be Abraham blinking Shakespeare. Let’s see, some of the poets over the years links to the Hughes off. Yeah. Amiri Baraka, there’s oh, Elizabeth Bishop. There’s just so many, you know, great poets that I would just love to have a conversation with no expectation other than to enjoy their company and and maybe just see what they think about the world. If you were to pick one of those, what would be a question that you think you would ask them. I would ask them. What was one of their more favorite poems or books, that they wrote. It’s always interesting to see what someone is closest to emotionally, because often, it’s not their most famous work, the most meaningful peace to them, probably because of a personal story or, or something has a deeper resonance, then, you know, looking at their stuff and what gets anthologized over the years. 00:55:14 – 00:57:55 That’s interesting. Well, that’s, that’s very good answer me. And unfortunately, we’ve come to the time that we hate. We gotta wrap this up, but I want to thank you for being our guest today. I know that most people that we interview have probably thought about creating some sort of press release promotion. And with this interview, we hope that people learned a little bit or maybe took some of the mystery out of it, right? So do you want to suck? Yeah, that I have a free masterclass on these press release strategies. Like I mentioned the survey and steady and there’s eight of those and it’s completely free. I’m trying to my customers to watch the darn thing. It’s less than an hour. But anybody who’s considering PR that’s a great way to start and see if it gets your juices flowing about ways in which you could develop strategic choices and it’s on, he releases.com forward, slash plan plan. It’s completely free. My goal is that you take lessons from it and things that might work strategically for you. Whether you do it yourself or use a service like ours. Well, actually, we’ve recommended that to a couple people. And I told my daughter about it, who has her own company and she watched it off, right? And, and really enjoyed it. And, you know, what we’ll do is, we’ll go ahead and put that link and under the show guests tab. So that way people can click on it and visit it and maybe answer some questions wrong. And more about it as well. But perfect, but thank you for sharing your poetry with us today, Mickey and also like I was saying earlier, just want to let everyone know. If you want to know more about making an off-site. We will have the links for him under the show, guess tab on thought, Rowe, podcast. So everyone can learn more about him and connect with him on social media and apps, web site. Yes, Micky. Thank you for your time. Today is most insightful. It was a pleasure. Okay. All right. Thank you. Okay. Bye. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas. We shared with you. We post a new podcast every week. So remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts, so you miss an episode. So it’s bye for now from my husband rod, and I wishing everyone a great day. Off.   Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 34: Ivana Mišić Life of a Concert Flutist & Soloist  In this episode, we interview Ivana Mišić a concert flutist and soloist who has worked with international conductors, orchestras, masterclasses, and competitions. She discusses growing up in Croatia and how her musical talents, inspiration, and creativity evolved from many life events and opportunities. We ask her some questions that we all wonder about when watching a flute player in an orchestra. Her answers may surprise you. Among many of her accomplishments as a performer, she has had the opportunity to play improv compositions with jazz ensembles and orchestras.   Show Notes:  00:00:18 – 00:05:05 I notice something you were doing last night Rod. Oh yeah. Alex how long possibly be every time you make a sandwich, you cut it into little squares. Why is that? It seems to be kind of a reoccurring theme in my life, probably noticed, Thursday and squares, but the real truth is a cut it up into these little four squares. It’s like having for sandwiches instead of one, I get to enjoy it more often. I get it makes it last longer in the diet tip. 4 people, right? I suppose. It could be. Yeah. Song. Hi everyone. And here we are celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice, I’m Rod Jones and I’m in G Jones. Welcome to the thought, Rowe, podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen and we are available virtually anywhere. You listen to podcasts. Yes. And you know what we’ve discovered? Yes, creativity is absolutely everywhere. Long as you don’t have to look very far to find it either like our guest today. Who happens to be a very accomplished concert and solo flutist today, we will be speaking with Ivana message from Croatia. You know, you and I both love classical music which is good that we have that in common me too and the flute is the oldest instrument in the world. And you know, I kind of would have thought drums made and I thought to the flute apparently is a full instrument. It’s an actual instrument. So this is really going to be an interesting conversation for Yep, but no, it’s time for your weekly quote. Okay, so the quote for this week is music is the Divine way to tell beautiful poetic brings to the heart and that’s by Pablo casals. Yes. And you know what he would know? That’s right. He would an okay. Now it’s going to be your turn, right? And let’s talk about Pablo out for a minute. You want to talk about Pablo. Okay. Just wanted to say one thing for wedding, things to the heart, you know, music. Okay. And then live in your soul, it just makes you feel really good. You know, you’re really right in and it has a different language unto itself, really? Yeah, he was like a touch as different places in your heart without maybe even words. It’s just musical notes. Sure, I like that. Yeah. So are you ready now for your motivational moment? Yes, I am ready. Okay, so now it’s your turn. It’d be better if I had opening music, something really Grand. Well, yep. Don’t have any opening music for you, because you did it pick any out? Oh well. So let’s, let’s have your motivation to come on. Don’t leave your dreams behind them home. That’s my today’s motivational. Moment moment, thank you. Don’t leave your dreams behind. So what does that mean to you though? You know, what’s interesting about our dreams, they usually start, you know, things that we want to be home, it starts when you’re a little kid, you know, when your child true. In fact, I remember when we interviewed Madison, the opera singer, she started realizing that she wanted to sing at a very young age and and ultimately, she knew she wanted to be an opera singer, which is, you know, that’s fairly rare for a young child, but she deeply knew that it was built within home and so many of us have dreams that start out when we’re children. And then, you know, life takes over. I think about my grandparents on their farm and change their dream was to make sure the crops came in and to raise five kids and they didn’t even hardly ever watch television and they were very happy. They seem to live a you know, they dead. Stresses, of course, but not like today. Why do you think we leave our dreams behind? Do you think it’s because life just gets really complicated, especially nowadays, it’s, it doesn’t sound like, when your grandparents were, you know, doing their farm and, you know, their their tasks, and their concerns were pretty channeled in and they weren’t so spread out all over the place where they weren’t being pulled so many different directions. And then also, as you mature, you have, you make some choices in life and especially if you get married, you get married and you’re young man, you have responsibilities to the family and maybe you, you know, you need to get a job. You need, you may have house payments or apartment rent, whatever you need. 00:05:05 – 00:10:03 Make sure you have adequate income to provide for your family and then all of a sudden, if, if when you were younger, you wanted to be a drummer in a rock band, right? All of a sudden you go, well, I don’t think that’s going to happen. And I have too many responsibilities and interestingly enough, some people as they get older and they retire. They look back over their lives and they start living their dream home. And which is, as I say, is better better at some point in your life, I guess than better than ever get better than ever. Well, you know, this, this episode is going to be somewhat centered around music, right? Yes, absolutely, yeah. And to me music is such an international language. It doesn’t matter what language you speak or what country you’re from almost, everyone can relate to music and The Human Experience by the music. They hear so true. In fact music, really, just touches your heart and so many ways that maybe even words can sometimes. You know, you’re really it speaks to you with the tone off. Intonations. So many different ways that certainly does in a lot of music is ritual to and ritual music goes back. Practically to the beginning of the time, beginning of time. Yeah. The other thing I want to say about music and I know when I hear certain types of music, it makes me want to eat certain types of food. Well yeah, I mean Italian food that’s what came to my mind off and maybe Greek food to a Greek food food. It makes you want to have a glass of wine and yes and some and some delicious Italian food Italian food. Yeah, so music off sets the stage for so many things that sets the stage for romance. It can. It’s very much involved in Romance violence, especially, I guess violence. And what was that song that I love? That was from the 40s. All of a sudden, my blank about battle, big band, sound, big band. Sounds there was a Miller, Glenn Miller how romantic was that? Well, especially when you consider that music off. Being played mostly during the time or time and couples that got together. Got married. Those are the songs that became very close to their heart option. When someone were shipped overseas, they would hear that music on the ship or even where they were based and it would remind them of their their love back home, the other loved back home. And then I’m sure there’s a lot, a lot of tears to a lot of people even later in life, when they’d hear that song. Again, they would think back to something that they had experienced. I mean, music does bring back experiences in life definitely does if you if you go to a cathedral and you hear an organ play generally will always remind you of the grandest of the cathedral it does. But the song jumping over to thinking about the people that we’ve interviewed, I really have enjoyed how we’ve had the opportunity to explore. How many ways? How many people? Find ways to be creative. Yeah, so true. And there’s so many different avenues that we really don’t consider when we think about creativity and inspiring ourselves and their journey and their Journey only when they when our guests have shared with us, their journey to becoming attuned, to whatever it was. That was so special times when they were a child and then as they matured and they still reflected him back on the first things that they felt when they first discovered, this is something that they really wanted to do and for the most part, are the people that we interview managed to live their dream. That’s so true. And you know what? And the thing about the podcast, that’s really interesting and and evolving is that when you listen to the different people and their experiences, you may not relate to someone that, you know, does welding or Opera. But there are tidbits in there that really cool. And enhance what how you think or your creativity? There may be just a couple of words that they say in the way that they handle their lives and what inspired them, that could also be an inspiration for you, for sure, their their personal stories are personal stories are fascinating and and we’ve listened to people tell us some of their deepest, thoughts and off and, and in many cases kind of emotionally. It’s been a discovery for us and actually has been a discovery for them because they, they had a voice. We gave him a voice and they could talk about how they got involved in their creativity, right on. But yeah, it’s time to introduce our special guest. 00:10:03 – 00:15:03 That’s true. Faith. Ivana, welcome to the thought, Rowe podcast. Where you know what? You’re going to be. Our very first dentist? Yes. Hi, even, we’re so excited to have you with this job today. Thank you so much. I’m very excited to break the ice. It’s so much fun to be with you here today. Thank you for inviting absolutely dead. Welcome. Well before we start our interview officially, we always like to ask our guest. What they had for breakfast. So what did you have for breakfast? Okay, so now I am in real life. It’s a city on the seaside increase their I have many concerts with Orchestra, so I’m in a hotel and I had Hotel breakfast, you know, it’s like I don’t know if you know, Swedish table, like you can choose a lot of things which are offered. So I had egg bread crusts on Thursday. But usually I you know, this chocolate feeling serials with like pillow pillow cereals with chocolate inside with rice milk. This is what they usually do. But today I had restaurant breakfast. Yeah. Oh nice. That’s nice. You do exit that which is makes it even better smartest, smartest, border, buffet, buffet place? That sounds good. Yeah, it’s very good. I know where you live because by grandparents immigrated to the US from there. Please tell our listeners where you’re from and what your country needs like. It’s so great coincidence to meet you. And to find out that, you know, we have this common thing to have described. I live in South Asia, in a capital city of the group. It’s a very beautiful country. And here I would like to use this opportunity to home. Say that it’s very great to travel to Croatia because it’s a so small place. You have a lot of a lot of things which you can explore like the seaside the mountains lot of national parks. I think two hundred more more than two Hundred Islands, which are so beautiful there islands. Where people come to like Rehabilitation, you know, with sea salt and the nature, like the how to say floss Flora from the forests and it’s really amazing to be increasing. The climate is very good. The winter is not so-called. That sounds nice. Very beautiful. Yeah, that sounds so nice. And it sound like, I’m perfect place to rejuvenate yourself physically and mentally, everything, spiritually, you know. Yeah, you know, both both my dog. My brother-in-law’s, I guess has been two years now? Yeah, it’s been visited there. They went to the Townshend areas where my grandparents grew up, and we still have some relatives there, but that’s what they said. When they came back, obviously they showed us some pictures that they had taken. But probably the thing I really enjoyed hearing from them was how gracious and warm and combined everybody that they met in your country. They they they could not speak enough about how Charming helpful caring. They just waved you live in a great country. There’s no doubt about that and I’m not just saying that because that’s my lineage but it’s true. It’s true. Yeah. Creation people like to meet new people and they have so much Hospitality in their veins, you know. They usually like to be good. They like to make people feel appreciated and welcomed. Croatia. That’s why we are very much, two rhystic country. There’s a lot of tourists coming abroad. So yeah, it’s very nice to come and Croatia, you should definitely come when you’ve finish. So that’s our, that’s our goal of our whole family said, you know, they go this time garage and energy, you have to come with us. So that’s our plan is a great great. Yeah. Hey. So I guess, my first question is share with us your journey and to becoming a flutist. Okay. So I’m not from a musical family. Everyone is mainly economists arrange and field, and politics, and this kind of jobs. 00:15:03 – 00:20:06 Yeah, when I was a kid, I was really good at singing in kindergarten, and after some time, my mother asked me if I’m interested to go back. Musical school and I just say, I want to play flute. It came like out of nowhere. I have here. It anywhere on the radio or television, just came up my mind. And this is how I started to started to play flute and I really like flute because you have to produce sound with your own breath. And I found this really amazing because it’s really natural to connect the music you are playing because we all have to breathe and this is something true. Yeah. And this is where natural very of playing. So I I really enjoy playing the flute. Yeah, that’s interesting. How old were you? When you first picked up, the flu shot. I was nine, nine years old. See that’s pretty young. Yes, yes, yes. And it’s very good to start in the young age because you can fix. Think, before you start to think and, you know, analyze everything. Yeah, that’s very true. That’s very true. Yeah. You know, it’s my understanding that the song, the flute is the oldest instrument in the world and as a classical performer, would have been some of the challenges that you’ve had playing this instrument. Well, when I was studying flute, of course, I had the challenge to find a good sound. This was, this was from for me, the biggest challenge during Academy wage, I think it’s took me three or four years to figure out what is my sound like, not to copy sound of my teacher, not to copy some of them, some food player. So I was listening to. So yeah, this was, this was my biggest challenge in this process of becoming professional musician because also offer our growing your personality. It’s also difficult to find out what is your style. What is exactly? You like? Or you don’t like? So these are some things like also figuring out myself. Also, it’s a reflected on the flute. Yeah. Interesting. So interesting, you know, I when I think of maybe playing in an orchestra, I always feel like you have to pee A little bit void of style. So that way you’re doing what the concertmaster wants you to do the conductor. But you have to be a little bit more taking I guess that’s especially if there’s yeah, he wonders for flute players. Also side by side panel, have everybody different. So it’s really encouraging for me to hear that. You have to, you know, you work on your own style instead of being. Yes. Just playing by the notes, basically, you know. Yeah, yeah. I also play an orchestra very often and in a way not literally. I often find Orchestra as a corporation. So everyone is important. But you are part of a big group and you have to follow the rules in order to contact them successful and this is very challenging for me. That’s why I am freelanced good player and I like to change orchestras and symbols chamber music so I just don’t fix dead. My personality and my style of playing to one Orchestra because this is very important to me to stay individual and never lose my sound and my life expression. This is very important for me. That makes a lot of sense. I guess, if you’re familiar with a, if you’re part of a full-on Orchestra, you’re always playing what the life you said. It’s kind of a corporation. Oh yes. Yeah, you’re you’re fixing to play but, you know, I heard that some leaders of Corporations come down on musical, rehearsal for orchestra to learn about team-leading and to learn about how system is going because to play in orchestras actually, I mean, I talk to musician is very natural. You know, you have the notes, you have Dynamic, you have conductor button Corporation, these things, all need to be communicated and it’s very easy. Resting what we can do together and thinking about it, how we can play together. And this is also very interesting. That’s why I’m still playing in Orchestra, right? Because this is so interesting. So I can imagine it really is, you know, before I ask you the next question, I want to mention that the your audio sounds incredible and I want to listeners to know that you’re actually talking to us from a concert hall. 00:20:06 – 00:25:07 Oh yeah. I’m just now I have to record the some videos for my website because I’m supposed to do coaching for students. Yeah, we’re going to, I’m going to ask you about your teaching in a little bit, but my question was the the whole world knows them live music performances during the last year, half or so? It literally stopped. I mean, it came to a screeching halt, do to test and there have been some virtual performances. Taken place. But how is this. Affected your business as a musician? Well, it was very difficult because for one whole year off have any performances or concerts and basically nothing was happening. This is very difficult part of the year. I would just practicing and, you know, reading books and doing whatever. I can just to stay motivated. But in two months, before two months considered started to happen, and now I’m very lucky that I have so many concerts off my summer is really full week, various concerts, and it’s difficult because now here in the account, just two days ago, they brought a new law that we have to offer the coverage free concerts. So everyone who is participating in concert, both Orchestra and audience, they have to have negative test result or off. And this is little bit making all this harder to organize. Even though we are, we have concerts outside on the, in the like Arena, you know, off the old arena. Yes, opener. But still we have to, we have to have this thing sorted. So this is making things difficult. But somehow we are managed. I think play hard. I just been particularly hard on musician. So I mean we we saw one on television and then we noticed that the audience, they were all sitting several seats a part. They all had their mess. We also noticed that the performers obviously, if they had if they were a woodwind or float or whatever, they were worried a mask but the temp Oneness or the off, the string instruments, they all had their masks on and it was kind of it was kind of a little interesting. Yeah. Saying the leaves resting. Yes, it’s so difficult because dead Can you wear a mask? You have difficulties with breathing and no matter if you are violent. There’s also need to everyone has to wear masks, except when players, but it’s really difficult, then when conductor is trying to say something, you cannot hear him because it’s lower lower sound off timer. Yes, it’s so difficult. I really hope this crisis will end soon and then we can try to find now on the home know we have to be very flexible and also try other Solutions. Like you said earlier digital concerts digital manifestation, especially with two became a New Concept for it’s really terrible. But this can be true today. There’s nothing like a live performance through, there’s nothing. Yeah, it’s so different job. Because when you are there and it’s happening in this human factor of, you know, making music is changing the whole feeling, but I have to be happy for what we have and try to make it better in a job to mean. It’s, you know, it it might serve a purpose somewhere. A little creativity wage was so, you know, maybe it’s a good thing, I don’t know. Yeah, so we can assist, you know, earlier we were talking earlier about you starting to play as a child. Now, it seems like the earlier a child starts to play an instrument, it builds self-confidence, and stimulates the brain. What are your thoughts on that? Well, to be honest, I don’t remember that. I was confident as a child to be performing and everything. So I think that’s very difficult to have confidence when you are starting to play. And but, but it’s it’s very good to start early because of the body wage because body changes when you are, when you grow up and you can make your fingers faster when you are a child. So some, some practical things are not good, their their advantage advantages and disadvantages. 00:25:07 – 00:30:02 I know, for example, I think Jean-Pierre rampal this is good player passed away very famous. I think he started to play flute when he was eighteen years old and he managed to become most successful the flute player in his time. So there’s no way Jose There is no glue to anything because, you know, exception makes those will. So, yeah, but it’s good for me that I started this earlier. Yeah, to play the flute. And I’m, yeah, well, you’ve maintained a passion for it? Yes, yes. Yes. That’s the important part. You know, when when when you see a flute player up close, it’s obvious that they have to hold their lips in certain position to make the fluid have the different intonations and sound, is that difficult to do? I know you talked about a little bit, but, but when you watch a food pair, obviously, they have to hold their lips a certain way. Yeah, I’m really amazed. How you made this observation? I have to say this is Julie amazing Q. This. Yeah. It’s it’s a special way of of blowing their fluid is the only wind instrument who has open house. To play. So it’s more difficult to produce the sound on a flute than it’s on a saxophone or the clarinet. Because on, saxophone, you have closed closed. I think, mouthpiece in English is called and you, you just put your lips on it, and then, of course, you need to work on the sound, but I think that sounds, comes immediately through the, the printer instrument, but food is different because you have to have an embouchure, which is with four children. We use the Expression. You have to think that sleep is like a snail on the, on the mouth on the mouth piece. So it has to be really. Yes, really? It’s it’s, it has to be a widen up and walk to the multiplication. This is really difficult to produce and there’s so many other schools of food, playing some people don’t claim. Like a snail on the mouthpiece. Some people have a different temperature, but they, we can talk about this really long. So yeah, I hope this is okay with the recall, my twins. I mean, they have read read and there’s nothing between you basically, in that opening in the flute. Yes. Yes, everything has to be controlled by your lips and how your breath. Let me ask you a question cuz I’ve never picked up a flute in my life. As far as I know, although I watched a lot of flute players are you blowing across the opening or into it? You know, you would not believe but 70% of the air goes out, so just 30%, so it’s going in the in the foot. Okay. So you are kind of blowing across. Yes, yes. I blow a lot of across this is it’s impossible to God. To blow exactly the whole amount of air in the, in the hole. And that’s why so difficult to play flute because you have to have really strong lungs. I noticed as them growing, my lungs have been big since I was small, so I have lungs like us. Like I’m swimming, you know, like I’m professional swimmers interesting and really wild, huh, you wouldn’t think that with the flute at all? Like I would think that like a trumpet player or a tuba player, somebody with this very big instrument off. Yes, it sounds like the flu requires more breath control worse than any other instrument. Well, I think all the instruments require a lot of birth control is just different different system and it’s a little bit different to to produce. The sound is more difficult, maybe in the beginning, but when you are going down The professional level. I think we are all in the same problem. You don’t have to be sales and you have great music, but it’s interesting. Also, the small instruments and a lot of pressure and lots of bread. For example, now, I’m also playing Piccolo. It’s it’s also instrument from the families of fluid, and it’s very, very small instrument, but it’s so much power and pressure. And it’s really interesting because, as you said, it’s it would be kind of normal to think big instruments require a lot of wage. 00:30:02 – 00:35:01 I have not tried big instrument, I just tried the bass flute and it’s bigger than this foot and I just don’t need so much. Air is on on concert flute bamboo now. So it’s it’s very interesting that is interesting too interesting and I’m sure the doctors are going to because you see these instruments but you don’t really you don’t know what it take wage. To know, you know, and the inside from the actual. Yeah. You know, you yes. Listen to him but you don’t get the inside true true. Yeah, yeah that’s been a soloist and a concert performer. What are some of the experiences that you’ve enjoyed the most in the concerts? Well one patient came to my mind. It was not a concert but it was audition for the Dubrovnik Symphony Orchestra I think the third round and I had to plan Certo wage which is one of my favorite concertos ever written for food. So when I had to play, it was very cold in the whole and because the whole Was Made of Stone in Dubrovnik, city of city of Croatia. There’s lots of this kind of buildings all buildings which are made from Stone and it was very cold and my audition song, Was during the winter. And I remember this was maybe the the highest density of concentration I ever had on the public performance. I was home. I felt like this composer. Carl Lentz Nielsen is sitting next to me and we are on some very big grass field and in the Norway and I started to cry in the middle of one, really nice melody. And this is the moment I knew that I’m going in this audition because, you know, I was so much into it that I felt I was out of that space at that moment. It was really incredible. Graduation. That is wonderful. Family finger so much. Well that’s going to actually work real well with the next question I have. Yeah, we learned from you in an earlier conversation that you’ve been called upon to perform. Improvisational pieces up with those variations to meet that challenge and in a couple of minutes, I’m going to ask you to play a couple pieces But First Choice. How do those variations? Well this what you mentioned I played the couple of times what I call free improvisation. I want to get a quote on this because maybe some jazz musician. Don’t call this free improvisation. It’s very different, but the way I see free improvisation is when you should say. How you feel. So you don’t have any rules, no Harmony switch. You have to play. So you just stand on on in the contract call and then you play how you feel. So I had the opportunity to play in this kind of concert a couple of times once was dead. With the Jazz Orchestra of the academy where I played regularly and I had solo, which was during the project Harmony of dissonance. And I was just to play, let’s say, bipolar. So I played something which was really melodic fluid, very nice Terror against. And then I slide in into something, which reminds me on the chaos, or without harmonies, and very high density intervals. And this is very nice experience, because I never knew what is going to come up from my flute because this was the Only Rule you have to play, how you feel. And sometimes you know I I don’t feel every day the same. Why? Something’s like you were great. Some things I’m open. Something’s I want to be alone and it was really interesting because you know, it was not so small concert wage Was actually in the Big Concert Hall in Zagreb and it was full concert hall. And you know, the lights are on me, everything is black. And then I think with my head, I don’t know what time going to play. Just have to let it go. And this is really incredible. Wow. Yeah. You know, that’s the brings more attention, wage the words so low energy. What do you think if we ask Ivana to play a couple of things for us? Maybe maybe if honor you can play a little bit of an improvisation. 00:35:01 – 00:40:04 And then of course, I know our audience would love to hear something a little bit more classical. We’re going to let you get ready and then we’ll be right back with you, okay, perfect? No problem. Off. Off off. Off. Off. That was absolutely beautiful. Beautiful Ivana thank you, thank you for sharing your flute. Playing with our listeners today. Yeah I think I did expect it to be so wonderful but you don’t really good. Yeah about how can you tell us about the two pieces you just played? Yeah sure. So first place I played was my personal phone conversation and I was thinking maybe it would be good to share with our listeners. Yes, the city of react. I mean now it’s very rainy and it’s somehow slow in the Sunday. There’s not so much people in the road so this was my picture. I had in mind while I’ll play this. I played this game improvisation. And also I want to share and somehow evoke the smell of rain in the city. Oh nice place. And the second piece I played. I thought it would be nice to share also with our listeners, the Nielsen concerto I mentioned from the, my own experience in the public performance and they played the excerpt from the melody. When I started to cry in this person sneezed just hearing it that you telling us a little bit about the background of each piece. I mean to re Ur, they were both beautiful, beautiful. But you give you a little bit of a background on a that just icing on the cake. Yes, thank you. Well, you know, you were talking about performing home And, you know, I would like to know before you go out on stage to perform a solo, what is going through your mind? What do you feel when you’re when you’re doing? Well, that’s so interesting question. Actually, I I’m very excited before I have concerts. I don’t some special ritual on the day of Kwanzaa. I usually don’t practice much. I practice, just 1 hour and I do some light meditation, but before concert, I just stay calm in in the backstage. And when I start performance, I forget about everything. I practiced, I forget everything, I maybe fear of some choices. I, there are difficult. I just let everything go and I let the music lead me to to the concert. So it’s, yeah, it’s off. Some special resolved. I just tried to let go as much as I can. But certainly seems to be working. Yeah, and and it’s also, I love that you’re putting yourself in a place of just letting it flow through you. 00:40:04 – 00:45:03 Instead of getting worked very well, especially as mechanically unless mechanic or a more emotional. Yeah, it’s it’s the most difficult thing for me, it’s feels like I have to jump from the bowl time and I will, I will fall on the clouds. I know that I would fall in the clouds, but still, it’s really difficult to jump. You know what I mean? It’s a nice feeling after solo career after it’s all over again, especially dice daily life. Yeah, you often I know you often perform in ensembles and you have to work with just a few fellow musicians. How does that work for you? Well, that’s very nice because usually incorporate and play with musicians who are already my friends. So it’s just like, oh, hanging out through the music and discussing the details and finding out the, the perfect mode and the perfect, you know, the perfect pitch. But it’s different with every group. Sometimes I have one friend and piano player, We we played Duo and we are now having a concert in Chicago in another city. Yeah, it’s a dog at ML and which team I always have long rehearsals. It’s sometimes five or six hours worth of rehearsals and we just go into the music and we cannot stop. Practicing. Oh beautiful. It’s it’s very good. You know, people are different wage Some with some people I just feel like I don’t need to rehearse at all like we can just go on the concert and play. This is also very nice because you can offer this kind of trust and you can feel that other person is following your thoughts and your intentions. So both of both of these things and way of playing, I really like and enjoy, I like the diversity. So it’s everything is very interesting, every part. See that’s really wonderful. Such Dynamic relationships with people and also identify, you know, with one. I don’t need to practice. It’s good. I have distrusted. Yeah, you just want to practice because it’s just so much fun. I think. Yes, right. Yeah. Now I know there have been some great composers that have written. Compositions specifically off the flute. Do you have a favorite? Well, I I do not have a favorite because there is so many. It’s it’s like you have to pick a favorite person in your life. You know, I have to choose. Is it my sister or is it my boyfriend? My mother you’re not. Everyone is so special in a different way. I walk a couple of them just to give you some information about what is my preference in music? So yeah I really like bok choy. Some kind of special connection. Everytime I play Bach. I feel like I’m in the universe and like, I’m floating to the planets, and every place has its sound and it’s very, very special composer for me. But it’s really difficult to play, but he’s really complex composers. So you have to really prepare off. I think, I think box sat around and said, I’m going to give flute players flutists a hard time. I mean, you really wrote a beautiful compositions for the float. Yeah, I suspect that they were very challenging to play and she’s not the only one, you know, there’s a lot of composers who, for example, prokofiev, he seems like he makes compositions, which is always little bit a.m. Of the, you know, the technical possibilities of the instrument or just the range not arranged is always, you know, you can all play off all the notes, but technically, the way he brought passage in the music, it’s sometimes so challenging that, really, I’m thinking why is this but you are when you practice and when it’s a well-practiced, then it’s very rewarding to play this kind of composers. Yeah. So, do you do to each other’s to play the flute and, and when you are teaching them, are you using some of the same techniques that you? Yes. 00:45:03 – 00:50:02 Yes. I I use technique that off my teacher on Academy. Her name is Renata and I really respect her school of teaching, the flute because it seems like to be really perfect. Formula for a great sound and technique. I always used her her way that she taught me, but also I like to add my personal, my personal way of teaching, where I also like to know with the student. I like to know what is happening in their life and this is very important for me to study about their how to say in a psychological way. So then there’s tension in some aspects of life. Then I thought how to, how to respond on it and wants to work on and maybe, what kind of compositions would be very suitable to this student? Because every, I think about all the young people have some problem when they are, you know, in the puberty and Adolescence this is very, very fragile fragile. In every month Remain life. So this. I like to combine this rational way where you have you know, one plus one is two and I like to also woke combine with the other way where I trying to find out what’s, what’s troubling them. And then I started out try to sort it out, help them to sort them out by themselves and this is how I like to build confidence. This is important for me. Well, lucky is the student that has, you know, that’s really special. I mean, it’s just not. I remember my music teacher which I failed miserably. Add Mister Geiger. I mean, he was, he was one of these music teachers that he would pick up an instrument and throw it at you, really? Yeah. So imagine there was too many people in our high school band that went on to become musicians off. Mostly learn how to wear hard hats. Oh my God. I’m so sorry. It’s okay. I guess we could all live vicariously through your successes. Sure that’s really good. Yeah, I know we’re getting kind of to the end of our end of our interview so I’m going to ask you the question that we asked all of our guests which is, if you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the Past, who would it be? Okay. It’s very difficult to answer this question because in my life I feel that I meet everyone who I have to meet and everyone in my life seems to be fulfilling their purpose off. But there is one person who I would love to meet if I have possibility and this is Conductor Herbert for Ankara and he is my favorite song. Doctor. And I always, they always analyzed his recordings and how he conducted. And it’s very interesting because he always conducted with his office is closed. This is very unusual for conductor because he is standing in front of the orchestra. And his eyes are always closed and this amount of trashed she gives to the orchestra that they will leave his. They will follow his hand movement. It’s so incredible. And I would not just love to sit with him on the bench. I would love to work with him in the orchestral. So yeah, of course, that’s a that’s a beautiful answer. Wonderful answer. And I think it’s really interesting that he condemned the site, close he best. I mean, he’s very obviously connected. So the music is and he’s feeling it as he’s directing, but he’s also getting all that wonderful feedback from home. Musician. Yes, yes, it’s so incredible. It’s like his connected to another world while his conducting. And it’s also possible to see this in the, the recordings, you know, black and white recordings of his performances. I’m imagine how is like to be in person with this incredible human being. And it’s probably more more exciting and more thrilling than it’s, when I see it on recording. So, yeah, he’s yeah, he’s a person. I would love to read off what a beautiful answer. A great answer and unfortunately, we have to say goodbye. 00:50:03 – 00:51:42 Yeah, you’ve been sent off fabulously, but you’ve been a fabulous? Fantastic. Yes, absolutely. And your tips I’m leaving out. I don’t think so, awful. You been like Thank you so much. I’m very flattered by your words, but I must say that you’re so great host, and I’m so relaxed to talk to you and this was really incredible experience for me. Thank you so much pleasure in what region is, well, you know, I have to let everyone know that if you’d like to know more about Ivana we will have links for her under the show. He’s just a bond thought, Rowe podcast, so everyone can learn more about her and connect with her and social media and her website. So I think that yeah we need to wrap it up so thank you again Ivana for being on the right, thank you. Okay, bye-bye, bye-bye bye. Thank you so much. Bye everyone. I’m really glad you tuned in today. We hope you enjoyed the thoughts and ideas. We shared with you. We post a new podcast every week. So remember to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts so you don’t miss an episode. So it’s bye for now from my husband rod and I wishing everyone a great day. Off. Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 33: Candy Yeldham – Makeup Artist & Fashion Model We’re excited to have as our podcast guest, London-based British Makeup Artist, Candy Yeldham. She travels globally for magazines and editorial assignments. Candy works regularly on fashion shoots with celebrities and models. She even does a little modeling herself when time permits.  On this episode of the Thought Row Podcast get to learn the in’s and out’s of the world of makeup artists. Our guest has a tremendous background in creating makeup that is perfect for photography, stage, video, and film. She also discusses life in front of and behind the camera.   Show Notes: Opening music R: I don’t understand what you’re signing to me. You’re moving your hands all over the place I: Okay…I’m letting you know that you need to get ready and pay attention…so we can start the podcast.  R: Ok, Ok…I get it now. I thought you were shooing a fly.  I: No…this means go…and this means stop. R: Is it time to go?  I: Yes…let’s get started…this is going to be a great show…with a great guest.  R: Hi everyone…And here we are…Celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice… I’m Rod Jones  I: And I’m Inci Jones…Welcome to the Thought Row podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen. We are available virtually anywhere you listen to your podcasts.  R: No matter what you do creatively this is the podcast for you.  Inci, what are we discussing today?  I: Today we’re going to be speaking with Candy Yeldham, makeup artist & model. R:  You know I have known Candy for several years. She’s a beautiful model and a very talented makeup artist.. Let’s hear this week’s quote.  I:  Okay, so this quote for this week: The most beautiful makeup of a woman is passion. But cosmetics are easier to buy. Yves Saint Laurent  Discuss –  I: Now it’s your turn Rod…We are ready for Rod’s motivational moments.  R: If you’re going to take photographs with your mobile phone, do yourself a favor and those that have to look at your images, by learning the rule of thirds. You can Google it.  Discuss – Ok…we’ll Google it…but what are the rule of thirds, for those that don’t know.  I: You’re on social media frequently, what is the one thing that really annoys you about the pictures people post?  Discuss – That is too easy… taking pictures in the mirror and for the sake of all of us. Shut the lid on the toilet.  R: What about you? What’s the most annoying thing you see on social media?  Discuss –  I: Ok, let’s go the other direction, what is the most wonderful thing you see on social media?  Discuss –  R: What is the best thing you see on social media?  Discuss I: The wonderful thing about social media…and yes…there really is a good thing…is you can visit far-off lands and see scenery that you may never see in your lifetime.  Discuss  R: Speaking of beauty…let’s bring on our charming guest Candy.  Play middle music.  R: Candy…welcome to the Thought Row Podcast, we are excited to have you as a guest.  I: Hi Candy… I know our listeners are going to be as excited and I am chatting with a makeup artist today.  R: Candy… We’ve known each other through social media for several years, and I’ve really enjoyed the photographs you have posted of various people you’ve created makeup for. Plus, the fact that you are also a model…you have been photographed beautifully.  Candy – replies I: Ok, Candy before we officially start the interview…We always like to ask our guests what they had for breakfast. R: Being a makeup artist is an exciting career. What inspired you to become a makeup artist?  Discussion  I: We’ve learned that you are an expert in many types of makeup application. What have been the biggest challenges?  Discussion R: In one of my early careers I was a fashion photographer and I worked with makeup artists and top fashion models. You have managed to pursue both forms of creativity. And from my experience it is pretty rare. Tell us about your pursuit of both creative careers. Discussion R: As a makeup artist you’ve had to work with photographers, video & film production people…which one of these do you find to be the most demanding?   Discussion   I:  Have you ever done stage makeup?  Discussion R: I know that for makeup artists it’s not always about making people look beautiful. Have you ever had to use prosthetic appliances?  Discuss   I: I want to ask you a question about your modeling career. What was your very first modeling gig and how old were you?   Discussion R: It’s interesting that you have found a home, both in front of and behind the camera. What has been the most gratifying for you?  Discussion –  I: Makeup can take on an artistic look…almost fantasy or even abstract…like a painting. Tell us about your experience in that very creative area.  Discuss I: What are three makeup staples that you recommend that are not the traditional mascara, powder, lip stick?  Discuss –  R: This is not a question that I would typically ask…but tell Inci and I what the latest makeup trends are.   Discuss I: Candy when we had our initial phone conversation prior to the podcast you mentioned that you’ve had to develop positive energies to keep moving forward and motivated in your careers. What advice would you have for others that want to adopt that strategy?  Discuss –  R: What would you like to accomplish in the next two years?   I: So now… we’re going to ask you a question that we have been asking all of our guests. If you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past, who would it be? R: Candy, thank you for being our guest today. And thank you for sharing your thoughts and ideas on living a creative life.    I: I agree with Rod….our listeners are going to enjoy this interview. Also…Just want to let everyone know…if you want to know more about Candy, we will have links for her under the show guest tab on Thought Row podcast.com. So everyone can learn more about her and connect with her on social media and her website.  Rod & Inci – Thanks for being with us today…bye for now.  Outro Close music.   Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 32: Nalini Malaviya – The Creative World in Bangalore India We are always proud to have creative guests from interesting places in the world. Nalini Malaviya is from Bangalore, India, where she is an art consultant, curator, writer, founder, and publisher of Art Scene India. You will learn about the art, creativity, and culture of this beautiful part of the world. Nalini is very open and candid about her personal journey and her philosophy when it comes to artistic creativity. We know you will enjoy this creative thinker’s thoughts and ideas.   Show Notes: Opening music I: Guess what I saw on FB this morning? R: I couldn’t possibly imagine…because you see a lot of things on Facebook in the morning. But tell me what you saw this time. I: Well, there is a new food trend that people are really getting into. R: And that is… I: Get this…smearing butter on saltine crackers. R: You’re kidding me right? Haven’t we been doing this since childhood? I: Yes, that’s what I thought too. I know you like peanut butter on saltines.  R: Yep…nothing better.  R: Hi everyone…And here we are…Celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice… I’m Rod Jones  I: And I’m Inci Jones…Welcome to the Thought Row podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen. We are available virtually anywhere you listen to your podcasts.  R: Please remember to share the Thought Row podcast with your friends…Inci, what are we discussing today?  I: Today we’re going to be speaking with Nalini Malaviya, an art consultant, curator & writer.  R:  Nalini is from Bangalore, India. She is very knowledgeable about the art world.  I: I especially like that Nalini is such a genuine person when she shares her feelings and her journey.  R: It’s going to be great…Ok…Let’s hear this week’s quote.  I:  Okay, so this quote “The hunger for love is much more difficult to remove than the hunger for bread.” – Mother Teresa R: She’s a saint.  I: Yes, she was declared a saint and her name is Saint Teresa of Calcutta. Discuss –  I: Now it’s your turn Rod…We are ready for Rod’s motivational moments.  R: Well, I’m going to go with what I posted today, and that is… Kindness never goes out of style. I’m sure somebody has said this a million times before me, but it’s a reminder that we should all try to live up to.  Discuss  I: Seeing how we’re going to be talking to someone from India that has gained international notoriety, it’s important to think about just how small the world has become.  Discuss  R: One thing that I always appreciate is how open and real our guests have been.  Discuss I: You know…I’m really excited to move onto our interview with Nalini. Let’s listen to what she has to say.  Middle music R: Nalini…welcome to the Thought Row Podcast, we are excited to have you as a guest.  I: Hi Nalini… I know this is going to be a very informative conversation about creativity and art.  R: Nalini…I was fortunate enough to run into your website and I have to say, there is quite a bit of information there…and I had a wonderful time exploring it. Because you are an art consultant, curator, and writer. All things we would love to know more about.  Nalini – replies I: Ok, Nalini before we officially start the interview…We always like to ask our guests what they had for breakfast. R: I’d like to set the scene for this interview, please tell us about where you live.  Discussion  I: You have a beautiful name…we would love to know what it means. Discussion R: It looks to us that your website is the centerpiece for everything that you do as an art consultant, curator, and writer. Tell us about it.  Discussion I:  Nalini, you are one of those talented people that have the personal strength and motivation to transition through various careers. What kept you motivated and going?  Discussion R: One of the things I’ve noticed is that you curated a fundraising exhibition. Has that been successful for you?   Discuss   I: What is the art scene like in India?  Discussion R: How has the art community and you in particular adapted to online and digital platforms, especially in the last year and half, and what are the kinds of challenges you and others faced.  Discussion –  I: Do you have a core philosophy you like to live by?  Discuss R: Would you share with us, and our listeners, your connection to the spiritual side of your philosophy and how it impacts your creativity? Discuss I: Nalini, you are living a life totally immersed in creativity. What would you tell others about living that life?  Discuss –  R: I’m going back to something you responded to earlier, and that is the importance of family, and how they hopefully shape one’s desire to explore creativity and all its aspects. What are your thoughts on that?  I: So now… we’re going to ask you a question that we have been asking all of our guests. If you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past, who would it be? Discuss R: Nalini, thank you for being our guest today. It’s always hard to end an interview, especially because you shared so much with us today.   I: I agree with Rod….our listeners are going to enjoy this interview. Also…Just want to let everyone know…if you want to know more about Nalini, we will have links for her under the show guest tab on Thought Row podcast.com. So everyone can learn more about her and connect with her on social media and her website.  Rod & Inci – Thanks for being with us today…bye for now.  Outro Close music.     Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 31: Mike Farnham – Photographer’s Evolution It all started with a Brownie Hawkeye box camera and taking pictures of family vacations. As he grew up, he joined the U.S. Navy and was assigned to a nuclear submarine. From there he went to work for the United States government, which during those periods of his life he developed and nurtured his skills as a photographer. His work allowed him to travel to many exotic locations around the world. Affording Mike the opportunity to create amazing landscapes, architectural and editorial photographs. What makes this episode so interesting is how Mike’s journey through his occupations gave him the opportunity to become a very talented and recognized photographer with many accolades to his name. He is very forthcoming with his life story and how it ultimately shaped him as a creative maker of images.   Show Notes: Opening music R: People jokingly say take a picture it lasts longer. I wished that was true of the desert you made the other night.  I: Me too. That was really good, wasn’t it? And I did take of picture of it with my phone and sent it to our daughter.  R: And she replied? I: That looks so delicious. But little does she know, I tweaked the photo. R: And now we’ve come to photoshopping everything.  R: Hi everyone…And here we are…Celebrating what people love to do creatively by giving them a voice… I’m Rod Jones  I: And I’m Inci Jones…Welcome to the Thought Row podcast. We invite you to subscribe wherever you listen. We are available virtually anywhere you listen to your podcasts.  R: No matter what you do creatively this is the podcast for you. And please tell a friend about the Thought Row podcast. Inci, what are we discussing today?  I: Today we’re going to be speaking with Michael Farnham. He is a photographer.  R:  Mike and I have three things in common…we both were in the Navy, we were both on submarines and we both pursued careers in photography. Ok…but now…Let’s hear this week’s quote.  I:  Okay, so here is the quote for this week – A good photograph is one that communicates a fact, touches the heart and leaves the viewer a changed person for having seen it. It is, in a word, effective. It’s by Irving Penn Discuss –  I: Now it’s your turn, Rod…We are ready for Rod’s motivational moments.  R: Most everyone has captured a memory by making a photograph, which when posted on social media is just as fleeting as the thought itself. By me. Discuss  I: I remember the first time I met you in the studio and shortly after that, you photographed me for one of your assignments.  Discuss  R:  It’s interesting how valuable black and white photography has become. Discuss  I: Ok…So let’s hear what Michael Farnham the photographer has to say.   Play middle music.  R: Mike…welcome to the Thought Row Podcast, we always enjoy chatting with photographers.  I: Hi Mike, I agree and I know our listeners will enjoy what you have to say.   R: Mike… you and I have three things in common, we were both in the Navy, we were both on submarines and we both are photographers. At least I used to be a commercial photographer.  I: Yes…Ok, Mike before move on to the interview…We always like to ask our guests what they had for breakfast. R: We know that you have taken some pretty amazing photographs from various parts of the world. Tell us how you came to be in those locations.  Discussion  I: I found it interesting that you and Rod have a lot in common, especially the submarine part. Tell us about your time in the Navy and if that gave you an opportunity to start photographing.  Discussion R: Most every photographer can remember the first photograph they took. Which one are you most proud of? Discussion  I:  Tell us a little bit about the State Department and how that has been a career for you as a photographer.  Discussion R: You have mentioned that you like architectural photography, but many of the photographs that I have seen of yours seem to lean towards nature or environmental scenes.  Discuss   I: When did you first become passionate about photography?  Discussion R: As photographers, we all have our favorite subjects, what would be your very first choice? Discussion I: Do you ever write large descriptions to accompany the photographs?  Discuss R: What about photographing people? What are your thoughts on that?  I: What do you prefer…black and white photography or color photography?  Discussion R: Was there one person who you feel was the best mentor to you?  I: Name three things you hope to achieve or accomplish in the next year?  R: In less than five words what would you tell people that want to live more creatively.  I: So now… we’re going to ask you a question that we have been asking all of our guests. If you could sit on a park bench and chat with anyone from the past, who would it be? R: Mike, thank you for being our guest today. We suspected you were going to be a very interesting guest…and you certainly did not let us down.     I: I agree with Rod….our listeners are going to enjoy this interview. Also…Just want to let everyone know…if you want to know more about Mike and his website, we will have links for him under the show guest tab on Thought Row podcast.com. So everyone can learn more about him and connect with him on social media and his website.  Rod & Inci – Thanks for being with us today…bye for now.  Outro Close music.   Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Email

Episode 30: Ayelet Amrani Navon – Interdisciplinary Artist that Inspires Thought Our guest, Ayelet Amrani Navon, is an artist living and working in Israel. She paints, makes objects and installations, and experiments with one-on-one performative work. She shares her life and artistic journey with us and how she is navigating re-imagining her life from corporate … Continue reading Episode 30: Ayelet Amrani Navon – Interdisciplinary Artist that Inspires Thought →

Episode 29: Ruth Davis Abstract Floral Artist Our guest, Ruth Davis is an accomplished abstract floral artist. What makes this episode special is that Ruth shares with us and our listeners her deeply heartfelt expression of love and how she interprets and expresses that love through her artistic skill and medium. She became a professional … Continue reading Episode 29: Ruth Davis Abstract Floral Artist →

Episode 28 – Madison Marie McIntosh – Life of a Contemporary Opera Singer Our guest Madison Marie McIntosh shares with us on this podcast episode her life as a contemporary opera singer and performer. You will now have the chance to hear what it’s like to be an opera singer and what goes on behind … Continue reading Episode 28 – Madison Marie McIntosh – Life of a Contemporary Opera Singer →

Episode 27 – Tiffany Apostolou – Re-emergence of Greek Art Our guest Tiffany Apostolou seeks to bring art lovers in contact with the intriguing and bustling art scene in Greece while simultaneously drawing connections with the art scene in the U.S. through Peri-Technes, an art platform.  Her goal is to bring the reader in closer … Continue reading Episode 27 – Tiffany Apostolou – Re-emergence of Greek Art →

Episode 26 – Barbie the Welder – Metal Sculptor Our featured guest is Barbie the Welder, a creative talent that uses industrial tools to create magnificent sculptures. She teaches, and she writes books on the topic of welding. Among her many accomplishments, she designed the Harley Davidson 115th Anniversary sculpture that has been seen around … Continue reading Barbie the Welder – Metal Sculptor →

Episode 25: Duke Windsor – Modern Renaissance Man – Our guest Duke Windsor has lived an exciting life and has experienced opportunities that most men can only dream about. Duke shares with us each of the career paths that ultimately led him to become a fine artist. Duke began his exciting life journey in high … Continue reading Episode 25: Duke Windsor – Modern Renaissance Man →

Episode 24: Gary Spangler – Life of a Voice-Over Actor Our guest Gary Spangler voice actor, shared some of the projects he’s done where he’s created special voices for radio commercials and cartoon characters. Gary is one of those lucky people that has great control over his voice. He can go anywhere from a British … Continue reading Gary Spangler – Life of a Voice-Over Actor →

Episode 22: Linda Winter – What Saying YES Can Bring Into Your Life This episode has it all – travel, psychology, creativity, art, inspiration, and exploring the world. Our special guest Linda Winter, is an artist, psychologist, and teacher. She lives an enviable creative life drawing and painting the villages and scenery in Italy. With … Continue reading Linda Winter – What Saying YES Can Bring Into Your Life →

Episode 21: Rose Bishay – Exploring her Entrepreneurial Business  Our special guest Rose Bishay, who thinks creatively shares her journey into building an entrepreneurial business. Rose Bishay – How she became an entrepreneur. And the process she went through in developing and selling her key product – These Hands Lotion Mask. Rose discusses coming from … Continue reading Rose Bishay – Exploring her Entrepreneurial Business →

Episode: 20 – From Super Model to SuperArtist – Growing Gracefully with the Chapters of Your Life Our special guest Jennifer Moore Tymowska has been a top fashion model in New York, Paris and other countries. Once she completed that chapter of her life she became an artist and creates her magnificent paintings at the … Continue reading From Super Model to SuperArtist – Growing Gracefully with the Chapters of Your Life →