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Salsa Blanca Podcast
20 minutes | 2 months ago
Salsa Blanca Podcast #3 – Cha-cha-chá and danzon
(Lecture by Olavo Alen Rodriguez) In this episode, I dug up yet another old class I took in Havana, Cuba with Olavo Alen Rodriguez discussing cha-cha-chá and it’s origins. This was likely recorded on a very bad DAT or Cassette recorder but it is what it is. Hopefully there is some use for you. I did my best on the transcription. If you have corrections or suggestions, let me know. Transcript – Do you think that it was because of the influence of American genres? Some think like that, I don’t think so, I don’t think so. Others think that it was a phenomena, a cure because when they started to play here on this middle section, pieces of classical musical/famous songs or more recently from movies or something. You know, Singing in the Rain things, you could play any. Dance to danzon which has stars and stripes forever, played by Aragon orchestra in the 50s. Because somebody, a visitor came from the states and- And the best point about that was that it wasn’t easy to make another song because you simply took parts from different words and you put them together. So what mainly, if you’re playing a ballroom and you need to play a lot of danzon, you know you don’t have time for writing. They composed eight bars for the introduction. So the B section was a multi-sonata and now this 8 bars again and now this was B concerta and so on. And this was the easy way of destroying that song. That’s what some of musicians think. I’m not quite sure of that. But anyway, what really happened is that above the 40s, up to the 50s, about 1956 or something like that, let’s say up to the first half of the 50s, no longer danzon were played so much and cha-cha-chá was born. So we can say it’s in the same line. Now cha-cha-cha, yeah? – I got something, you know with danzon, especially in this charanga francesa instrumentation it sounds so gentile. Charanga genres that were orchestrated in real life, danzon was orchestrated in 19th century. – It is. – It is somewhat old fashioned and so antique and so gentile. It seems to me historically that, you know I just, it’s from another time- – Yes it is. – It has feudal overtones. – Yeah that’s right. – So did you say that cha-cha-chá came out just from danzon? – No. No, because look charanga francesa is an orchestra, danzon is a style of music. We’ve been talking about different themes here. But not exactly is a result of danzon, what I mean is of the same line, you know. That’s why we played them on the same crew. Cha-cha-chá was born when danzon died, something like that. And it was played by the same orchestra which is the name of Orchestra Charanga Francesa So that’s why, it came about as a result- – Do you know how the word charanga came? – Yes, I’ll walk you down there. Charanga and pachanga- Charanga, these are two words I think, in the average line anyway what it’s supposed to mean, charanga is the way of playing and dancing and dancing music. And pachanga was the party. So if somebody says I’m going to make a pachanga it means he’s going to make a party where a charanga is playing pachanga and so on. So and some thing like that, it’s very complicated. It’s very complicated. But anyway, that’s the name. In French, most musicians don’t agree but why French? Nobody knows exactly. There are some opinions I have read in some books, why French? Maybe because of the contradanza. It changed directly from contradanza which came from French influence. Maybe that’s the reason why charanga and francesa, maybe in Cuba anything can happen, maybe because it was so gentile they called French you know perfume and… anything can happen Yes. – Who did play at the orchestra son montuno ’cause that was done by the peasants and danzon was for the upper class- – Exactly. – When did that happen? – No, it had from the very beginning. It’s very interesting. That’s a very interesting question because yes, you see that’s the thing about Cuban culture. It’s such a big mix. Nobody expects that some style of music can bond with a musical form and with the mix of different social elements and environment. Even more further than that in this question, you’re asking if we go further on, no there were even racial differences. Not only, I mean, we were speaking about a time where the Negroes were were not allowed in the saloon, you know where white people were clients. Can you imagine that? Most of the people who trained danzon were mulattoes. So how did that happen, nobody knows. It’s Cuba you know, it’s just- It’s very funny, it is. But that’s interesting because it’s a rare example. Now I’m trying to go to cha-cha-chá and no more questions here? He speaks Spanish and he’s trying to, understand in English. El problema era que muchos musicólogos dice que el danzon desaparecida… Okay so cha-cha-cha. I want you to hear an example of cha-cha-cha but first I think you’ll be happy with the first cha-cha-cha written by Enrique Jorrin. I want you to feel the similarity to danzon. There was a development of danzon, a last development which is considered the ending of danzon which was danzonete. Also born in Matanzas, they are very proud of their music, danzonete which means a slighter, smaller form of danzon. Danzonete, as everything in Cuba, this is a French word. You know danzonete. And danzonete was mainly the same danzon but the difference was that they included a singer in the center section, a singer. And son montuno, they made it, I mean they shortened it, the whole danzon, and made a bigger C and a bigger D so son montuno. Also the son montuno had a different style of making music. Let’s hear, you can hear where- Not many danzonetes were composed, so basically most of musicians considered this was the final, the end of danzon. – What year is this? – 1929. Was the first danzonete – By Aniceto Diaz. Composer Aniceto Diaz That’s how we play nowadays the charanga Okay, now I think that, yes- – 1929? – The danzonete was 1929. – The recording’s from 1929? – No I don’t know if the recording is 1929. No, – Sir, I had a question. – No, I don’t know. I know the recording is a very old one but I’m not sure, the date is not written on the recording. But the music was from 1921. – Maybe they composed it in- – Yeah in Cuba. Now let’s listen to cha-cha-cha okay, I think it’s clear. When you hear separately, you can’t really tell. But when you hear together, it’s the same orchestra. It’s the same instruments This is just a verse cha-cha-chá 1951, first cha-cha-cha La engañadora by Enrique Jorrin. – But that’s 20 years- – Second section excuse me. So introduction, 2nd verse, but it’s no longer so clear. So a 20 year timespan between the last danzon and cha-cha-chá – But danzones were very played up to the 40’s There was about 20 years where danzones weren’t played Until the first of… That means 1941 to 1961 it was just about. So we have another section here So if you hear, danzon is still somewhere there. And you’ll hear son muntuno, very cool. A section again Now, son muntuno. “La Enganadora,” the words, the lyrics are very funny. A lady who uses, you know she wants to make me that she’s She puts herself as a, I don’t know how you say it, – Star. and she used to go to Prado and ??? streets – Where everybody all the men were on the corner, you know what I mean. Walked in front of everybody and somehow somebody discovered the secret and that’s why la enganadora means, engano is- – [All] Deceiver. – The deceiver, that’s right, enganadora. And nobody believes her any more, the enganadora, because everybody knew them. I think (it’s time for) another cha-cha-cha. Because there is a final attempt that I want you to hear. Emiliano Salvador. Playing contradanza in a modern way So this is a nice example because it brings the entire history back to the very beginning Played by a very famous jazz pianist He died very young I think he was a genius Emiliano Salvador. – He lives in Cancun? – No, no, he died. Okay so, I think we did it because I wasn’t expecting to have time to… More about cha-cha-chá and danzon here: https://salsablanca.com/product/ The post Salsa Blanca Podcast #3 – Cha-cha-chá and danzon appeared first on Salsa Blanca.
14 minutes | 5 months ago
Salsa Blanca Podcast #2 – Andres Rodriguez (Cuban Son)
In this episode, I dug up an old class I took in Havana Cuba with Andres Rodriguez discussing Cuban son and it’s origins. This was likely recorded on a very bad DAT or Cassette recorder but it is what it is. Hopefully there is some use for you. Transcript Alen: Okay. Now, we can begin speaking about son. The thing is to know where it came from, very generally speaking. Now, son … I would like to explain some things that there is a lot of confusion about. When was the first … when did … son was born. And also there is a lot of mistakes that very recently Cuban historians and people who dedicate themselves to gather this information have discovered there’s a lot of mistakes on books written many years ago. Alen: Maybe you have heard that the first Cuban son was something like El Son de la Ma Teodora. This is very common. You can hear this everywhere, El Son de la Ma Teodora. Son de la Ma … This means mother, Mother Teodora, La Ma Teodora. It’s called … It says nobody can actually say which is the exact date for the birth of son but during a very large period of time, history … the Cuban historians said that it … There was a document published in 1893 by Laureano Fuentes where he said that this Son de la Ma Teodora was the first son. It was composed by two sisters, Micaela and Teodora Gines. These were the two sisters. They were two nuns. Teodora was the one who wrote this song or anyway one of them two … The two sisters wrote Son de la Ma Teodora. So they say this happened as far away as in the 16th century. Good. Alen: Nowadays, we know this is a great mistake because what is important to know is that Cuban nationality and Cuban culture only was born on the second half of the 18th century. Before that there was no Cuban culture. So this is a big mistake. And now, what we … most of the people who do research, they say that they doubt that Son de la Ma Teodora existed at all. They think that this was a mistake by Laureano Fuentes taking a tune of last century … that was last century that sounded in some ways a variation of [inaudible 00:03:05]. He made a mistake. Even they felt that Teodora Gines ever existed herself. Yet, nothing is for sure. I say because you are going to be reading a lot of books and maybe even in, I don’t know, movies and things, this Son de la Ma Teodora. Now, we say it’s not true. Alen: Now, the real truth is that son begins in the countryside and very specifically in the mountains. This is one thing in theory. Another one is that they have a … It was born in many places of the country at the same time. But everybody agrees that this happened on the second half of the 18th century. Alen: And, now, we’re going to hear an example of son Sierra Maestra. Sierra Maestra is our biggest, highest mountains. And deep inside each woods, the mountains, these are recordings I’ve taken. It’s a party. It’s named nengon, nengon, nengon. Nengon is one of the names for son. You’ll hear there’s a … Changui is another name for a style of son and so on. So you can hear … That’s why son is a big group of different dances. Let’s hear this. Note how the transition from this African came to this. It’s very interesting. (music). It sounds African. [inaudible 00:04:48] the first son. [inaudible 00:04:56]. Speaker 2: [inaudible 00:05:14]? Alen: No. It’s a tres [inaudible 00:05:17]. Speaker 2: [inaudible 00:05:26]. Alen: No. There is [inaudible 00:05:22]. Speaker 2: [inaudible 00:05:27]. Alen: Maybe [inaudible 00:05:33]. Note he says that when you hear the recording well you can hear [inaudible 00:05:36] also. Here it sounds very [inaudible 00:05:41]. Okay. We got to get a better recording [inaudible 00:05:49]. Okay. Okay. Alen: So, now, we have [inaudible 00:06:13] son. Now, son expanded to the whole territory in a very fast way. Not only through Cuba, it reached also Isla [inaudible 00:06:32]. It’s a small island we have. It’s part of Cuba. And also Santo Domingo and Puerto Rico also it reached. In this area the son have the musical form of a round dance. And it took from the Africans the solo and the refrain, the chorus. Speaker 2: [crosstalk 00:06:56]- Alen: And it mixed up … What? Speaker 2: That’s often referred to as call and response. Alen: Call and response. Yes, also. Okay. Call and response. But the call and response it can be made by two soloists. Speaker 2: So- Alen: So you have to have a solo and a group. Speaker 2: [inaudible 00:07:15]. Alen: That’s the Africans. Speaker 2: Yeah. Alen: And also it got mixed up … what, with this alternation of solo and call. And it took the percussion instruments from the Africans and it took the guitars [inaudible 00:07:37], different types of string instruments, [inaudible 00:07:39] guitar and also tres, which is a Cuban version of the Spanish guitar. I’ll explain later what’s the difference. And we have, now, son. With all these mixings we have a new example of son. It’s very interesting this one. Now, we can hear the whole mixing. (music). Speaker 2: Seems exactly the same rhythm. Alen: But, now, we have the son [inaudible 00:08:09]. I think the examples are good. [inaudible 00:08:45]. Okay. [inaudible 00:09:57]. Now, of course, we have two choices because unluckily we need more time because I’m trying to do today son and danzon at least, because we have five groups, as fast as we can. Now, what is [inaudible 00:10:17]? The rest of it, what is now the more modern examples. After this, you can begin speaking about Benny More. You can hear Ben More. I have some examples. But we don’t have time. We don’t have time. But I think it’s already an introduction to son, I think. So what I suggest is to skip to danzon now, to do the same, to do the same just to … Now, danzon- Speaker 3: I have a question now. Alen: Yes. Speaker 3: Can you just explain how this kind of tumba developed, what you can hear on this recording in son? Alen: That would take … I know. I know. That’s what I do on piano lessons. Because if we do that you see tumba is quite different on each instrument. So I think tumba … It’s a question that is better solved on the instrument classes. Speaker 2: Yes. Also- Alen: Because it’s not the same tumba on guitars and in piano and so on. Speaker 4: [inaudible 00:11:18]. Alen: But we can do that in some moment. But really it will take … It would take a lot of time. I don’t think- Speaker 2: Also [inaudible 00:11:25] concepts, which is starting tomorrow, which is also [inaudible 00:11:29]. They explain a lot of that. [inaudible 00:11:31]. Alen: The purpose of this is to make a general overview, you see. That’s what we’re trying to do, to gather things up and then we go through specifically. Speaker 2: You mentioned the different names for different subcategories of son, the nengon and the changui- Alen: Yes. Nengon, changui, for example. Speaker 2: Were those correspond to different- Alen: Sucu-sucu also, that’s another one. Speaker 2: … geographical areas? Alen: Yes. Yes. Speaker 2: And then- Alen: Sucu-sucu, for example, is Latinos. Nengon is on the eastern side of the country in Sierra Maestra, for example. Changui also on the eastern provinces. Speaker 2: Do they use different instruments in different areas? Alen: Also, they have different instruments depending on what are the instruments of the immigrations. Sometimes it’s a little bit more Spanish. Sometimes it’s a little bit more French. Because we have tumba francesa from Haiti. Even British from [inaudible 00:12:33] we have the people living here. It’s very [inaudible 00:12:37]. But, yes, there is [inaudible 00:12:39]. Now, the second [inaudible 00:12:43] … The post Salsa Blanca Podcast #2 – Andres Rodriguez (Cuban Son) appeared first on Salsa Blanca.
24 minutes | 5 months ago
Interview with Charangoa
This interview with Orquesta Charangoa’s Fay Roberts took place in July 2011 You can download the album here: Lo Que Quiero es Charangoa or on iTunes Orquesta Charangoa Jon: I have with me Fay Roberts, she’s the founder and director of Orquesta Charangoa in Los Angeles. She has a new record out so we’re going to talk about that. But, I was talking earlier with her and we realized it’s been so long since we, A: had seen each other, but B: since we’ve met and recorded in Cuba. What was it, January of ’97 when we first met in Cuba? Fay: That was our first trip… we went on this study trip… and I remember we really connected because you were like: “I don’t have time to goof around, I’m here to study music!” and I really admired that. Jon: And I’m the one who ends up marrying down there… anyways… Fay: [Laughs] Jon: So, then, the interesting twist was, we both went back in December of ’97 and recorded some tracks for me with another singer in Los Angeles (which have actually not been released yet, they’re just sitting in my archives). But, that project involved Richard Egües who, unfortunately, passed on, but, why don’t you tell everybody what your connection with Richard was because he was such a big icon in the Charanga and Cha-Cha movement. Fay: He was, he was the flutist of the Orquesta Aragon during that period when they were the most famous and popular all around the world. And, he was the flute teacher when I went to the class and on the first trip (we went on a study trip in January ’97). So, luckily I had had some experience playing Cuban music and I had a lot of experience of learning and playing by ear and that’s basically how he taught. He’d play for us in the class and then, kind of, turn around and say: “OK, play exactly what I played or something really close to what I just played”. And my experience of having learned a hundred of Irish fiddle tunes by ear really came in handy. And, he absolutely took me under his wing and gave me a bunch of music on the first trip and said: “Go home and start a group, keep my music alive”. And, when I went back, on a second trip, I lived at his house, was there for 3 weeks and took lessons 5 days a week. Jon: Yeah, and I remember, I’m not sure that it was planned that you’d record a couple of tunes on that, because, I know, Richard was doing arrangements for me and him and his brother Blas were playing, but, it ended up that, I’m pretty sure, you played on at least 2 of the songs that we did. Fay: I did, and I have that recording still. Jon: I probably have it still as well … Fay: I have a copy of that. Jon: Yeah. Did you ever go back after that time, or see him after? Fay: I did not… Actually, once I got the band (Orquesta Charangoa) up and running and we started working, I was really working all the time and I never really had a window. And, it just wasn’t the right time to go back for me. Jon: Right, and unfortunately, he never got back here, to the States, so… Fay: Well, he did, one time before he passed away. I believe it was in the… (we can research this out), it was the year Tito Puente died. So, it was either 2003 or ’04 (editors note; it was 2006, September 1). A group from Seattle worked it out for him to come. He came with his daughter Gladys, they went to New York and visited their relatives there, then they flew to Seattle and then they flew down to San Francisco. We tried so hard to put together something so he could come down to LA, but we had a very short notice, the thing had already been set up. So, I went up to San Francisco and attended all of the things that he did there. Jon: OK, so you did get to see him. I saw him a few times just in my travels in Havana, but I never really saw him a whole bunch because he was always doing other things than I was doing… Fay: He was very busy… When he was in San Francisco I arranged to take him to lens crafter to get him a new pair of glasses. That was really fun, there were people who recognized him (at the Lens Crafter’s) and went next door to a CD store and bought something that had El Bodeguero on it…. Jon: That’s funny… Fay: … then brought it back to Lens Crafter’s and had him sign it. There’s a little bit of L.A. in the background there, that’s a siren. Yeah, and, he was actually, at that point, he was legally blind. It was… he just had, like, cataracts. And the thing is, since he wasn’t really driving so much, it wasn’t much of an issue (and, I assure you, at that point he was not driving at night). Jon: Right, that would be scary. Fay: Yeah, when I saw him walking around at night and how he was functioning, because I teach blind people, I went, “Oh my Gosh, now he’s legally blind too”. But he had people around helping him and that didn’t hold him back, musically, one bit. Influences for Orquesta Charangoa Orquesta Charangoa Jon: Right, well, let me lead you to your next, or, my next question is, you’ve got your new album out, does it have any of… I mean, obviously it would have his influences, but are there any of his arrangements, of his tunes in or are they all originals? Fay: The tunes are… you know, I thought I was including a tune that he wrote because he had given it to me and up until I went to pay the publishing, I realized that it was written by someone else. Jon: Oh, OK. Fay: And that tune is um… so actually, on the first CD I have 6 compositions of his, that he had given me, on the first CD. On the second CD, unfortunately, I do not have any compositions that he wrote. Jon: What’s the name of the 2nd CD so that they know where to buy it and all that? Fay: OK, the 2nd CD is called “Fay Roberts Y Su Orquesta Charangoa” and the title of the CD is “Lo Que Quiero es Charangoa”. And that’s named after, actually not the title track, because the title track I wanted to name it (“Que Viva La Charanga”) is already a CD by another artist. So, there are 3 originals on this CD that were written for me, for this CD, 2 were written by Johnny Crespo (which is “Que Viva La Charanga” and “Son Montueando”). It’s actually written by Johnny Crespo and Matt Amper. You may have heard of Johnny, he’s very active in LA. Jon: Yeah, I’ve heard of him. Fay: Johnny’s like a veteran guy. He’s in LA Salsa Society, Costazul… and Matt Amper is, kind of, a young and up and coming pianist. Who could take Johnny’s ideas and turn it into a chart, you know, to hand me. Jon: Right. Fay: The other tune, “Lo Que Quiero es Charangoa” is written by our pianist, and also, another singer of ours Fermin Sinfontes who is Cuban. Jon: Ok, who else played on it? Do you have your regular crew or… you’ve had some guests, I know that. Fay: I’ve had some guests. My regular crew is, the rhythm section, which is myself, Alfred Ortiz (Congas and Vocals) and Fermin (Piano and Vocals). I’ve got John Pintoff on Bass, George Ortiz who sometimes plays with me (he used to play with me all the time), he ended up being my Timbalero for the project and Tony Alba plays Guiro for us, and my violins are my regular guys: Pablo Mendez Sr. and Pablo Mendez Jr. I was lucky enough to get Adonis Puentes to come on board… … who’s a wonderful Cuban singer who is just moving to L.A. He’s been in British Columbia for the past couple of years. Johnny Crespo, I included him as a guest artist because he’s not regularly performing with me. James Zavaleta, I just met him through this project, very outstanding, talented singer in L.A. who sings in English and Spanish and actually works with a Persian band. And, Gonzalo Chomat who’s my regular singer but I called him a guest artist because he has a deal with Timba.com so we always announce him as a Timba.com artist. Jon: Right. Well, was there any theme on this album different than your first one or was it just, you know, “We just want more Charanga”? Fay: Oh yeah. There’s a theme. You know, the first CD, the choice of songs was really different. It was like, “What do I have from Richard?” and then I got some other contributions from an arranger Harry Scorzo who did all the Bongo Logic stuff. So, that was, kind of, the way the selection happened on the first CD. On the 2nd CD, it was like here’s these songs that my friends have written for us, for the band and then I did want to pick out something really, really outside of the box, which is “Just Dance”, a cover of the Lady Gaga hit. And Harry Scorzo helped me out on that arrangement. All the rest of the arrangements I did myself and I wanted to pick songs that reflect what the dancers want to hear in Los Angeles. Jon: Right. Charanga Dura Fay: People like something that’s a little bit hard core, a little bit faster, like, “What is considered dance music in Los Angeles?” And then, put our very best take on that. Jon: Right, because I notice when I listen to the tracks, the flute is definitely… you can hear Richard’s influence obviously on that, but I did notice that the rhythm section is a little bit more dura (hard) than you would find in New York Charanga scene scene. I mean, it’s got a more of an edge to it, I think. Fay: Yes, yes and it’s to promote the band in that light. It’s very hard having a Charanga in Los Angeles. I’ve had club owners tell me that I’m going to play Cha Cha Cha and it’s going to be really boring and slow all night. And, I think if they listen to this CD, they won’t think it’s boring, slow Cha-cha-cha whole night. Jon: No, there’s definitely… I wouldn’t say that at all because I’ve played in those bands and I get bored, much less the people listening. But, I mean
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