In Episode #17, Camille and Tanya share an honest and personal conversation about voice, voicelessness, and the future of Re-Storying the Culture. Tanya is rediscovering her voice following her ex-husband’s passing. At the same time, Camille feels called to her internal self, to mute her voice and listen for a while as new ideas gestate. How can these two close friends resist harmful narratives of Camille “abandoning” Tanya? By leaning into their individual truths, trusting each other, and returning to their original reason for creating the podcast. While Camille internalizes and quiets her voice, Tanya will expand her own voice and the conversation by bringing other people onto the podcast to share diverse perspectives on re-storying the culture. This new approach is centered on the leadership of many, honoring every person in the culture and creating space to share power and nurture new leaders for the future. It truly does take a village. Episode Transcript [00:00:01] Restoring the Culture is hosted by Tanya Taylor, Rubin's story mentor, and Camille Adair, family constellation facilitator. In this podcast, these long term friends explore how stories serve our lives. Their inquiry meanders into the realms of science, theater, health and consciousness. Moving the individual and global narratives forward as they draw upon their relationship as the laboratory for their experiments, in truth, so many of us feel isolated and alone in our deepest longing. Each one of us is necessary rediscovering the truth of our human story and listening to what is calling us forward so that we can restoring the culture together. [00:00:51] Hey, everyone, welcome to Restoring the Culture, I'm here with Tanya and looking forward to a conversation on voice or voice, lessness, voice of the voiceless. [00:01:05] And we're we're both out with that. And today, instead of reading a quote, we're going to communicate in a different way. And so if you'll just take a moment with us, we'll do this. This honoring and of sound. And then we'll come back to the podcast. [00:01:53] All right. Well, we're not musicians. That's for damn sure. [00:01:59] I was reading about how words began as sounds and so words sound used to sound like what they meant. [00:02:08] So I was trying to think of words that sounded like what they meant when they were still could inhabit, you know, the right hemisphere of the brain. A feeling right now thinking of the word cushion. I mean, that sounds like what it is cushion. You can feel the khush. But so many words have become just words to describe something rhyme. So they're becoming more objective and less subjective and. And that's part of us becoming less relational or less embodied, less in touch with our sensations. And that leads me to a conversation that Tanya and I just started having. And we're really both sensitive to the changes. In the field and my field, your field, the collective field. And when we started this podcast at the beginning of Kofod, our commitment really was to have honest, transparent conversations between us as friends and to make those public, you know, as an experiment. Is this going to serve? But how refreshing to be able to have conversations like that that have meaning to us instead of thinking, oh, we're gonna have a conversation about a topic. Because we think it's going to have meaning to other people. [00:03:36] And then we manufacture our thoughts based on what we think the outer world wants. Right. This was more about how do we share our inner world instead of manufacturing ourselves. We just share ourselves. And so. Right, one of the things that's starting to shift and change for me is that I feel like I'm being called to this. [00:03:57] I'm going in more internal and into a time of these sounds, these feelings. [00:04:05] And those don't always translate into conversations in the same way. [00:04:10] And so for the last couple days, I've just keep having this feeling about about not backing out altogether of this podcast because I want to support it. But how can I, in terms of the sisterhood, support this mission, support our friendship, support these messages when you add it to it. [00:04:30] And then we started talking about it. And you said after Stephen died, after 19 years, you have your voice back. And after a 19 year stretch for me, which we had never done the math on, you're unbelievable, Turnell. And I feel sort of mute in a good way, like I'm communicating in different ways and something is gestating inside of me. So one of our conversations that we're actually making public because we haven't worked all this out together. But we wanted to share it with you in the spirit of how and why we came together in this podcast is that I may take a step into the quiet under world and I might inhabit more of the voice of the voiceless. [00:05:12] And while Tanya's getting her voice, may be inviting some other people to come in as other other guests, that we've wanted to have diverse voices in here and take this opportunity like it doesn't have to be you or me. And a third voice. It can be me and another voice until things shift and perhaps shift again. Right, exactly. [00:05:35] We don't know. But it's really it's like this is part of that thing of listening to what's in to what's moving and what's wanting to happen next. And and I think it's this thing of being with the unknown. [00:05:51] It's such a powerful guide. I mean, it really is the next phase of leadership. I think totally early emerging. It's emerging somewhat in us. And I think this is really what we've been leading into for a long time. And I think it's actually like it's growing in us now. Right. It's this is leadership to listen. It is leadership to stand in the unknown and to actually not have the answers, but to be guided by what's happening within and around us and to speak to each other fearlessly. [00:06:26] That's right. Because people are so afraid of truth. And certainly back in our own history, yours and mine. Right. We've had times when we needed to have boundaries with each other or change something and we wanted to please each other. I mean, not just with you and I, of course, in our own lives, like this is what we've been conditioned to do. [00:06:47] The people policing versus, oh, I didn't plan on this, but life wants me to go some place. [00:06:56] Slightly different now or I'm being called to do this in service to my own soul and it doesn't quite make sense. And the outer world. Right. [00:07:05] Right. Mine doesn't make sense in the outer world at all. [00:07:09] And I really am so grateful that you hear me and that you understand it for what it is and that it isn't another story. It is this story. And that. It's just as valid for me not to speak as it is for you to speak. Exactly. No, totally. I mean, it's like the truth isn't truly and how we give voice to that truth, whether, you know, I did a checkout today in my constellation training and I had us check in with a sound and check out with a word or a sound. And I found myself humming along Labi. And it took me to such a deep place to look at all these faces of these people I care so much about on my screen and my class. And to be humming this lullaby and to have that be my way that I exit. I think we're so much needing to connect in these deeper ways right now. Right. And I feel like I'm going into some underground preparatory school for something that I don't know about what it is completely. [00:08:13] I mean, and I see that. I see it in myself. [00:08:16] I see. New ways of being are really springing up at almost cut coming from our last conversation. Restring 2020, it's like like we've been stretched around how to connect on screens with people all over the world in an intimate rather than a compromised way. [00:08:39] And so when you talk about humming the lullaby, like we're being called to go deeper with our imagination out to the greater aspects of consciousness. Right. And find that we're actually together, we're actually can stay close. [00:08:57] Even Mahvish, all these shifts happen. We can stay close while you are quiet and I'm speaking. [00:09:04] That's right. That's right. [00:09:06] You know that we can take these different journeys. I think this is what I want to say, because you and I started this podcast and we've we have worked the edges of restoring our friendship for 20, 21 years now. [00:09:21] And our friendship should have been lost many times by conventional or ego standards because we've had different ways of being different ways of acting out or suppressing our own trauma. [00:09:35] Different things with mother issues and female issues. So in in restoring our friendship, which is what I feel is the original intent. [00:09:46] How can I support you in going quiet without making up a story about abandonment or that I can't do it alone or that you don't care as much about me? What I'm saying is the myths we put on top of people's soul truth stops us from doing what we need to do, which is always put that soul truth first and create relationships where we're safe to speak them and allow them and be uncomfortable without the split. You and I talk about the split. There's so many reasons that we find from an ego point of view to go into the split when in reality, if we support each other in following our own souls, what greater possibility of love comes out of that or even creation in the future that we can't even imagine? Right. [00:10:46] I think that's right. And I think that we're doing it. I would say to answer that question, the first one that comes to me that's most obvious as friends is pick up the phone if you're feeling. If any of that starts coming up for you. Just pick up the phone and I'll remind you. I would say the other thing is that it you know, in terms of the lineage of this podcast, it started out as a podcast between two friends. Totally. And all we do is speak the truth. This Calzada ride with Camille and Tanya, right? That's the order that we wrote it in. Camille and Tanya with a small C small T right wrist. And now I'm saying I'm going to do some. [00:11:29] I'm going to just stay for a while, you know. Can you carry restoring the culture and invite other people in? [00:11:35] And then I just say I'll be there in spirit. Remember me? Invite me on some time, call me and say I want to do a podcast about this. You may not be on it. Is there anything that you would add to the conversation? I mean, I'd love to stay close to it totally. [00:11:51] And that is the restoring process, right? [00:11:54] Hey, the toxic old culture we're moving out of is the one that can't hold different needs at different times. [00:12:03] And then what it does and as part of the split is then it puts people into exile. Right. You're either in or you're out for pressure. Right. Those are false dualities. Tim doesn't have to be in or out. It's just the truth that we started this together. And now I'm going to take some time to go into my voice soullessness because something else is growing inside of me that's really important that I listen to. [00:12:29] And you are coming into a time where you're going to be talking and having more conversations of restoring the culture with other people, that it will be in service to restoring the culture. [00:12:39] And if we're both in service to restoring the culture, then we know we're in the right place. No problem. Totally. You're both standing behind restoring the culture as the founders. [00:12:50] That will never change, but it doesn't mean you can't take it and carry it. [00:12:55] And I trust you to do that. [00:12:57] And I'm really grateful that you trust me to go underground for a while and just take something that can't come into words yet. So it will come into words, but I can't speak it until it's ready to be born. [00:13:10] Exactly. Now. Totally. [00:13:12] And what does that look like for you? I'm curious about the how how it would be restored for you between us. [00:13:20] Well, I think just even a deeper commitment to the divine directives that are coming through. It's very clear to me that right now you and I are both so highly aligned with our intuitive selves and our souls that are guiding us to individual purposes, manifested in us in great service in the world and. [00:13:48] And outright honoring that that that is why we're choosing to shift the form that it's not from any old story. It's from the new story of what does it look like to just radically allow ourselves to change any outer stories to serve the soul because the soul is guiding. [00:14:10] So for me, I think it means just following, like honoring the genesis of this is about our relationship and that energetically you're still in the field as a. [00:14:26] I wanted to say fairy godmother because I was looking at you with your red lipstick and I thought, you look like a fairy godmother today. Anyway, you know, it's like you're here and present. [00:14:39] And so it's honoring that presence of who you are. And I think just trusting that directive that what I hear you saying is you're trusting the directive of my soul right now to invite the people I'm most drawn to talking to. [00:14:56] And I sort of have this feeling that in the future, it could end up being a vehicle once again for you to invite in some of the people your most strong to talking. Right. Right. [00:15:05] You know, we can play with what that me can play with it, because now we've so established our voices here and who we are and what we're about, we can play. But for me, the vision is to just keep following the desires of my soul, the dictates of my soul in terms. [00:15:22] And asking other people, bringing in other diverse wisdom from different voices, people of a different gender or people of, you know, maybe who are non binary with their gender, who knows people of different backgrounds, different levels of expertize, both inner and outer diversity. Right. What is their vision of restoring? [00:15:44] Cause to me, where we're building a new culture that's based on our abilities, many different abilities of others who are also drawn to restoring the culture, who see the big sort of systemic issues and have different gifts to bring to the table because it's such a big inquiry. [00:16:08] Right? It's it started out small, but it's so big. [00:16:11] Interesting, because this is reminding me of, you know, I had a couple different midwives for solace. You were the first midwife in the very beginning of my movie. And then my friend Sylvia was a midwife toward the end of the movie. She helped me create a nonprofit. [00:16:32] You know, she really I mean, the last year of that push of editing and, you know, getting it ready to to move out and to be born. Right. Right. You know, I had a midwife in the beginning and a midwife at the end. [00:16:46] And I was thinking about that, you know, that maybe some, you know, in different ways were midwife things, something tons of heart of the story of the podcast of of what's happening here. And that that's a that's a special place. Right. And medicine and midwives don't stick around in the same capacity forever. Right. Right. They change and changes. Yes. And it can be purposeful to be in a place for a time. And and that role can change, right? I mean, it can evolve and it can change. Yeah, that's it. [00:17:17] I guess that is sort of the big takeaway for me is just feeling more comfortable being in the unknown and being willing to go with the change without having to know why. I don't exactly know why, but I'm getting this directive that's pretty loud and I think it has to do with a new time I'm going into at the same time that you're coming into a new time. [00:17:38] It's so fascinating. We hadn't talked about these 19, 20 year cycles, you know, until today, until today in the pot, right before the last podcast. [00:17:47] And and then and we've known each other for a little longer than that. So we have the privilege of the entire 19 years. I mean, I knew Stephen before he was. Yes. Schizophrenic, you know. Yes. Before I got married. Yes. It's really interesting, right, that we have known each other through two big chapters, you know. [00:18:11] Well, huge stories. And it's funny. It's true. When you said. [00:18:15] Yeah, I mean, I remember I mean, playing that role for you with the film and supporting you and coming to some interviews and I think helping facilitate the connection with Grant through and and Dara. [00:18:30] That's exactly right. You know, like those things that have to happen. And then now, OK, we're getting something new here in this form. [00:18:38] And yeah, I think it's I mean, I think it's a great metaphor to use. [00:18:43] Oh, and I was going to say that now when I work with people on their books, I say to. People, there's an illusion. You're going to have one person take you all the way through. But the way I've set it up with my team, I say you really need a story mentor to make sure you've got a story really worth telling. You need a coach, a writing coach who's going to show up every week like the midwife and get you through. Then you're going to need a different person to be that editor because they've really got to have that literary background to be a professional editor and then somebody who's going to help you get it published. So here it is. It's like, you know, same thing in a solo show. It's like you need the director and you know, you need the coach. You need the director. [00:19:23] There's a whole thing, the people backstage and that these one person projects. Right. That's so of this culture to assist in it when it's just really this beautiful circle of souls that always comes together that makes anything significant happen, no matter who's the one that's the quote unquote face of the project. [00:19:46] Well, it reminds me of that saying it takes a village, right? It takes a village to raise a child. [00:19:50] I've been thinking about that in terms of, you know, the depth psychology community. It really takes a village to grow, you know, someone in this kind of a container to do this work. [00:20:06] It takes years and it tears more than one person and it takes time to raise a child. [00:20:13] And in even when I think about like a friendship or a marriage or a business, you know, you have so many false dualities that say it's going to be one person. There are many ways that we get to love and there are many ways that we get to prosperity and there are many ways that we get to feeling fulfilled in friendship, right? Yes. Doesn't have to come through one face. And I remember. [00:20:43] You know, you and I used to talk about a couple years ago, we started talking about the new face of leadership and we were seeing a sea of faces right there, that that is the new face of leadership is the money. So it's kind of taking me full circle to that metaphor of it takes a village. [00:20:58] And when we know it takes a village, our only job is to listen so that we know when and where our right places in terms of serving the mission as a village person. Yeah. [00:21:09] I love that as a villager. Truly, again. And that's the thing, too, about I'm reading an amazing book right now called Sand Talk on Indigenous Leadership. [00:21:20] And it's the circle, right? It is the talking circle. [00:21:24] It's everybody being honored. It's indigenous wisdom from every corner called the Earth. [00:21:31] It's Pande Cultural. [00:21:33] And yeah, it's just making me think how if we're in right relationship and we talk about matriarchal circles, it's there. There's always we're just villagers. And that that's the new leadership where we're villagers. [00:21:48] And what's our right place at any given time. And then allowing that to shift. And one thing, can I just share one thing that came up like about American like power? [00:21:59] We were such we're grabbers of power and then we try to hold on to the power. [00:22:04] You know, last night and and this isn't to discredit at all the amazing contributions and the culture of Justice Ginsburg, who died yesterday, two days ago. [00:22:15] But she had an opportunity when Obama was in office to retire and have him replace her. And she stayed. [00:22:25] And and now, you know, there's this whole disruptive thing about on the wrong side gets to replace her. Well, all of us. And this goes so beyond red and blue, as you and I have talked about. [00:22:36] This is about power. And when we hold on to power, we and I see this in myself. [00:22:43] I understand it. I'm out of my space as a villager. And when I'm also reluctant to step into my power, I may be out of my places. A village or in the divine sense. Right. I see us almost like divine chess pieces not being manipulated, but rather being led in and out of different roles in the circle in Western culture is like hold on to that power forever. [00:23:07] You know, it's like it's a power grab and you know, and that's so much about the split in our culture rather than we can share. [00:23:15] And also, sometimes it's time to mentor younger people and to power other people into power. [00:23:21] Well, that's really where it's up for me. It's whether it's chronological age or it's going to be a new experience for some of us. Right. Right. That it's something is showing up for them. [00:23:32] And I think. That's I mean, it really is I feel like my. I feel like I've been turned inside out like I'm going to be somebodies teacher on some level, I feel like then I share their karma. [00:23:47] It's a big deal. Yes. To step in to train someone or teach them this isn't little stuff. Right. These are on some level like soul contracts that come in. And it is it's a big deal if you're really listening and you're really honoring, you know, the potential for what can grow inside of that kind of relationship. Not to say that there are boundaries and clear beginnings and endings and graduations because those things are really important. [00:24:13] But I do think that. We're just so much more connected than we recognize. And I think somehow maybe we're waking up to more of our connectedness, and that's a beautiful thing, which means we're really here to serve each other. [00:24:30] Period. Period. I don't care what the power structure is. Yeah. We're here to serve each other. And if we get off that track, we're going to suffer. [00:24:39] Period. Exactly. No. And it feels so important to me to just say, if we're being called to teacher lead in any way, you damn well better have trusted peers and allies as well as elders are self on this side or the other side of the veil. It's really important we turn to regularly to stay in our integrity because there are so many ways we can take missteps around our power. [00:25:09] Because that's right. How we've been conditioned, Frank. [00:25:12] That's right. And I think in a way, you know, it takes me back to my hospice days like this is all death and dying work, you know. Yeah. I mean, it's like we should all be in a process of succession planning. Yeah, for sure. I'll be 55 on my next birthday, but I can't tell you. I'm thinking every day I think about, you know, my my own process of succession planning as part of my dying process. [00:25:36] And, you know, that time setting up have been setting up my new business plan with the woman I've been mentoring for seven years. [00:25:43] Like bringing her in closer and bringing her in with other teachers on my team and older people and also honoring her own wisdom as a millennial. [00:25:54] But like, you know, we're having these conversations that I'm having these conversations with everyone on my team. That and even changing the name of my business from Taryn Taylor Rubenstein to sematic writing, because I want sematic writing to go on beyond me. [00:26:10] So. Right. [00:26:11] You know, and we you and I have talked about that with our potential work together, perhaps in the future, like how if we're not thinking in a systems way that can be in the greater service, we're missing huge opportunities and actually missing our part of real power, of being able to lead people in to sustainable practices that can deepen and deepen and deepen over time, whether we're here or not. [00:26:44] That's exactly right. And then then it's I find when I when I am in that place, it's such a great relief. Like the seduction tells us, there's not going to be enough. So we have to hold on to what's ours and be known when you let go of that. That's where the relief as you just it's like then it's like you just want to push other people up. That's really our greatest way of being. My God service and being as being known is to become somebody else's root system. Like, how do we become nourishment for the root so that these plants keep growing in this human world or in the, you know, the human ocean? [00:27:20] It's so I mean, I even see it in my business. I've been trying to play roles that aren't mine because it's not just my business. Right. [00:27:28] It's such a relief when I bring in other people to take that over. And it makes me bigger, not smaller. But noticing, you know, the fear from the ego around delegation, around spreading money around whatever, but like really standing behind myself allows for. [00:27:46] The spaciousness of others certain. [00:27:50] I want to kind of end my part with sharing a little story about succession planning and how surprising it can be because we don't always see the fruits of our of our service and our love. [00:28:03] Right. And I when I first started teaching in Nashville, there was a young woman who took one year of training for me. And it was before I put the whole program together and knew that I, you know, my way would be, you know, three different levels in order to really serve people. [00:28:17] And it was OK because that was a work in progress, it was evolutionary. But she. So this was three years ago. She recently had a baby who I think now is about four months old, and she sent me the most incredible video of her in the shower with her daughter, and she's holding her cat, her iPhone up. [00:28:39] And while she's making a little video of her baby girl, she's saying all these healing words to her like, you are my daughter. I am your mother. I see you. You belong. And the baby literally was like the look on her face every time this young woman would speak. This baby looked like she was like in this rapture, Jolie. It was just the most incredible thing. And I thought. I never in a million years would have guessed that that Constellation training would become such an integral part of how this young woman would become a mother. We did constellations while she was pregnant. We did a constellation before she conceived for this baby. Amazing. MIA So like I just thought, oh, wow. What is the ripple effect? We don't know. But it's such it's such a testament to saying true staying true to what our calling is, even if that calling takes us underground for a while as mine is doing. Right. Yeah. [00:29:51] And even if that calling manifests in the world in the last year of our life. [00:29:56] Exactly. You know, I had a I had an amazing acting teacher, Bill Hickey, when I was young in New York. And he was just always this sort of outsider character, you know? And oh, my God, he was incredible. So he would always talk about every story is a love story. You know, he was that guy I've told you about, you know. [00:30:15] And he was like 70 years old. [00:30:17] And he was like it just looked like he was always just going to be this amazing marginal teacher who every now and then got a role, a small character role on or off Broadway. [00:30:29] But, you know, and then at that at like 70 years old, he just he got put in a film and was nominated for an Oscar. He didn't win. But I remember watching him. You know, he had a shock of gray hair and his bow tie was like askew cause he was kind of just one of those. He almost looked like a homeless person, you know, dripping in his tuxedo like 90 pounds. I cried when I saw him. [00:30:53] But then from that opportunity, he worked as an actor constantly in film and movies for the rest of his life. And he never became a household word. But I always thought there he was like from 70 to 80. And after all those years of being so devoted to his craft and his students and his love of acting and his mastery, bam, you know, there it happened. [00:31:20] But even if he'd hadn't, he would've been on Bank Street teaching the classes, coming late to class, eat drinking because his whiskey out of his thermos. Right. [00:31:30] Because goes house, you wouldn't have been any less secure when you can as one person and so on. And it's a contributor. That's right. Right. [00:31:37] So it's like the devotion to our souls journey. [00:31:41] And if we ever waver from it to just come back, come back, come back, and the deepening deepening is going to take us where we go, no matter what happens at the outside in the world. Right. [00:31:54] You know, you look a great like Van Gogh who didn't sell a painting in his lifetime. And 100 years later, you walk into the Louver, his he's still present. Why are you laughing? [00:32:09] Oh, he's awake. You know. Well, I'm glad we'll still be laughing together. [00:32:16] I may not laugh for a while on this podcast, but I want to say it's really been an honor and a privilege to be a part of this. And. And I leave it with you. [00:32:29] I'll take it from you, Camille. And you win. And we'll just say in terms of the outer story, always to be continued to continue and to you and to yeah. [00:32:40] To all our listeners. Just know I'll be bringing on some amazing people in this during your inquiry. [00:32:47] In the meantime and I want to just give a special thank you shout out to Grant Taylor, my dear friend, and and the person who's been editing these podcasts for now. And he is a friend of both of ours. And he's another 19, 20 year relationship and a totally f part creative partner. [00:33:08] Well, wait. That was when we met him through. [00:33:10] And a Darah. Exactly right. A year ago. So much gratitude to Gray. [00:33:15] I know. I know. All right. Big love. [00:33:24] Thank you for joining Camille and Tanya for this episode of Restoring the Culture. If you were inspired, we would deeply appreciate it if you would leave a review on iTunes or any other platform where you heard our podcast. For more ongoing inspiration and support, please join our no cost global Facebook community. Restoring the culture. You can support our podcast by making a donation here. And remember, we are each restoring the culture as we reach story our own lives. See you next time.
