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Using Shopper Language Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the sixteenth episode of Grocery Guru: The Importance of Using Shopper Language in your category. Not using industry terms or category terms because they are creating the buffer for what should be created. By eradicating industry terminology you will discover opportunities to communicate better with your shopper and then sell more. You Can Read the Full Using Shopper Language Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to Episode 16 of the Grocery Guru with Andrew Grant. How are you? Andrew Grant: Hi, Darren. Good morning. Yeah. Very nippy I think is the best thing to say this morning. Darren A. Smith: It's supposed to get to minus 10, but let's move on from how cold it is. Last week, we said to our viewers that this week we would talk about terminology. Now, I'm going to lead the charge on this one, because something that we're doing wrong as an industry, or as category managers, or as suppliers, or as supermarkets, is when we use terminology that the shopper doesn't understand. Darren A. Smith: And I'm going to give you an example. My dad used to run, he was a project manager in a Sainsbury's store back in the 70s. And they used to have those three-legged tables and he used to have the best top fruit display in the area. "But Dad, what's top fruit?" So Andrew, what's top fruit? Andrew Grant: Do you know, is top fruit, apples, oranges, and bananas? Darren A. Smith: Well, it's apples and pears, but I didn't know. I had to ask that. So there were the signs that say top fruit and I'm thinking, "Well, no one understands what top fruit is." When I asked that, he didn't know. So eventually, some years ago, I asked some guru in produce. And he said, "Well it's top fruit because it grows at the top of the tree." Andrew Grant: Okay. Yeah. Darren A. Smith: These can't be terms we can use in our industry if the shopper doesn't understand them. Andrew Grant: Well, I guess also, going back to your dad in the 70s, there's a lot of stuff. Obviously, supermarkets kicked off in the 70s in terms of the superstore format. And there's probably terminology that was invented back then, maybe meant something to customers back then. But because most people are used to sticking their dinner in a microwave and heating it up for two minutes, it's been lost. I mean, the one that gets me, condiments. Does the average millennial know what a condiment is? Would they expect to wear it rather than eating it? Darren A. Smith: That's condiments. So, our challenge to our viewers is, the more we can use language that the shopper understands, the easier the category is to shop. Andrew Grant: Yeah. Darren A. Smith: And the flip side of that coin, the more we use examples that the shopper doesn't understand, the less easy it is for them to shop, the more they'll go somewhere else. So I wanted to give you another short story. Darren A. Smith: I was buying frozen fish for a supermarket, many years ago. And in the conversation I used to have on the phone with my account manager, we called two products, the most popular selling battered frozen fish, 076 and 077, which was their scheme number because we could differentiate it away from 079 and 080. That's crazy. Andrew Grant: Well, I guess internally it's not an issue. There's a whole industry lexicon of three-letter acronyms, isn't there? Darren A. Smith: Yeah. Andrew Grant: Or four letter acronyms. There's your GSC, your PORS, your LFLS. Those never, if you like, leak out to the shopper. So I guess that's okay. It's the stuff that gets in the shopper's face that they just don't get. I mean, to flip the condiments one on its head, one of the more modern categories in world foods. Now, world foods. Okay. Pretty broad category. But why does just about every supermarket spit out pasta? Because I think pasta's a world food, isn't it? They have a world food section, they have a pasta section. Darren A. Smith: The bit

Purchase Decision Hierarchy Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the fifteenth episode of Grocery Guru. This episode discusses the purchase decision hierarchy, shopper map, analytic hierarchy process, consumer decision tree... Whatever you call it, understanding how the shopper shops is key to category performance. You Can Read the Full Purchase Decision Hierarchy Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to episode 15 of the Grocery Guru with Andrew Grant. Andrew, how are you? Andrew Grant: Good morning, Darren. Yes. Very, very well. Thank you. Darren A. Smith: Good. Good. All right. Well, this week we're going to get stuck in straight away because I know you and I had a debate earlier about purchase decision hierarchy. What the hell is it? Andrew Grant: Yeah, no, absolutely. The way customers decide what they're going to buy. Darren A. Smith: Okay. Andrew Grant: And a lot of commentators have said it's no longer relevant in the world of shopper insight. When a club card swipe can tell you everything you want to know about your shopper, category management's dead, isn't it? Darren A. Smith: Well... So it's also called customer decision hierarchy, consumer decision hierarchy. I like to call it shopper map because I think it gives you a map of how to shop something. And if you can't understand the map, you're not going to shop it or you're going to buy less of it. Andrew Grant: Yeah. But a lot of people would say, the minute you've got that club card or that loyalty data, you can see inside the basket and you can see what the shopper bought with what, when, from which part of the store, how often and how that links to his or her family situation. So why do you need to spend time at a flip chart, working out what the customer decision hierarchy is? Darren A. Smith: Because I think we need to know what decisions the shopper makes both before and at the fixture. Andrew Grant: Well, let's do a little test because I do believe that actually loyalty data is, as we kept going on about it, it's the future. And it can tell you a lot. There's one thing it can't tell you. So, Darren, I take you'd like a bit of wine? Darren A. Smith: Yes. Andrew Grant: I know you like to whine, but you do like some wine. Darren A. Smith: I like wine. Go on. Andrew Grant: Okay. So let's assume you are going on an essential journey to your local supermarket this afternoon. Darren A. Smith: Yep. Cool. Andrew Grant: And you're going to shop the wine aisle for the weekend. Darren A. Smith: Yep. Andrew Grant: Just do me a quick picture on a piece of paper of what you're going to buy. Darren A. Smith: Okay. Right, pen. Andrew Grant: Yeah. Darren A. Smith: Ready for rubbish drawing? Oh God, I feel like I'm back in art class at school. Now, this is what we buy as a treat. And I realized only six months ago, I've been saying it wrong for 20 years. Andrew Grant: What, Liebfraumilch? Oh, right. Darren A. Smith: Barolo. Andrew Grant: Okay. Right. That's interesting. You've drawn a bottle of wine. Darren A. Smith: Yes. Andrew Grant: So you're not in the market for a box of wine or one of those little miniatures that you used to be able to get on a train? Darren A. Smith: Not if I'm going this afternoon because it's Friday. No, for the family, who's the kids now drink wine as well. Kids in their 20's. Andrew Grant: So this is the bit where I think customer decision hierarchy is important because what a club card or a loyalty data can't tell you is that subconscious decision. You decided before, almost without thinking about it- Darren A. Smith: Yeah. Andrew Grant: ... I'm in the market for a bottle of wine, not a five-litre box of wine. Darren A. Smith: Yep. Andrew Grant: You've made a subconscious decision. It's the same with cars. If I asked you to draw the next car you want, you would probably draw a four-wheel-drive SUV. Darren A. Smith: Yeah. Andrew Grant: Yeah? Because you've subcon

Range Reviews and Resets Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the fourteenth episode of Grocery Guru: Discussing Range Reviews and Range Resets. You Can Read the Full Range Reviews and Resets Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to episode 14 of the Grocery Guru with Andrew Grant. Andrew, how are you? Andrew Grant: Hi, Darren. Good, good. Thank you. You? Darren A. Smith: Yeah, I'm good, I'm good. Looks like you're at your mum's, am I guessing? Andrew Grant: I am at the homely palatial pile. Darren A. Smith: Very nice. Very nice. All right, looks lovely. This week I think we're talking about range reviews, range resets, that sort of thing. That's what we discussed? Andrew Grant: Yeah, I think we said last week, not a lot hot happening out there. About the only bit of newsworthy stuff to come out is Morrisons have had a virtual supplier conference and have announced a major category reset. What I found quite funny actually is some of the learned publications out there picked up the fact that it's a 170 category range review. Darren A. Smith: Wow. Andrew Grant: But published it as Morrisons to change 170 products. Yeah. Darren A. Smith: Well, that's not many, so that shouldn't take long. Andrew Grant: Might take them about 12 minutes, I reckon. Yeah. But no, it's 170 categories, full-on range reset by the sounds of it and utilizing their new Morrisons Edge shopper insight technology. Darren A. Smith: And is this their hookup with IRI, am I guessing? Andrew Grant: Yeah, with IRI. Darren A. Smith: Okay. So a crazy time to be doing a range review, range reset? Andrew Grant: Well, yeah, exactly. That was my first thought. We don't know what the new normal is. So they're going to be looking at a year's worth of data when... just take a few categories. People haven't really bought any sandwiches for lunch. People haven't been doing meal deals. Everybody's been baking at home and cooking at home. So ready meals sales probably aren't reflective of whatever the new normal is. So I think it quite, quite difficult to do a range review when the world's been turned upside down. Why the timing now, is slightly bizarre to me. Darren A. Smith: I don't know. I mean, it's a topsy-turvy time obviously to do it, and you're basing it on data that may then change as shopper habits change, we come out of lockdown, blah, blah, blah. Is it a brave move to be doing it? I think not is my suspicion. Not a brave move. Andrew Grant: I suppose, as long as they put a common-sense rule over it. But obviously, we don't know what data will come out, but you can sort of, with some of the macro trends we've talked about over the last few months, you could almost imagine a situation where a whole aisle of flour, you de-list ready meals, you take out front of the store and fill it with masks. That ain't going to be the new normal back in, hopefully, in May, June, July. Darren A. Smith: You're right, it's not. And I think with what we could both credit our friends in Bradford with more intelligence, and of course, they're not going to put a whole aisle of masks in, but it comes down to the nitty-gritty, doesn't it? Are they going to extend baking by 20% and then try and change it again in June when they go, "Hold on, we're now not all baking"? Andrew Grant: Yeah exactly. So it will be interesting. And I guess for the suppliers out there, our clients, it's going to be quite a challenging range reset for them to go through. I guess our message is we've got a lot of experience of this. And obviously, the inevitable negotiations that will come to fruit from the winners and the losers being put under pressure. So I guess, yeah. I guess the message of today's webinar is that we're here to help if there's any Morrisons supplier out there caught up in this range reset. Quite important, I think, that they spend the commensurate amount of time on it because it's going to be a weird one. Darren A. Smith: It is. And also n

The Basic Principles of Negotiating Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the thirteenth episode of Grocery Guru: The Basic Principles of Negotiating and the Squredance. You Can Read the Full Principles of Negotiating Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to week 13 of the Grocery Guru, and we are with Andrew Grant. Andrew, hello. Andrew Grant: Good morning, Darren. How are you? Darren A. Smith: Hey, I'm good, I'm good. Lockdown, blah, let's not go through that. We've got a few weeks to go, vaccine. Let's talk about Grocery, what's going on in the world of Grocery this week? Andrew Grant: Well, it's been a quiet week, actually. You look at the news-wise, not very much has happened, actually. Nothing stands out. So I thought maybe we'd talk about, I think we did mention it last week in the end. Let's go back to basics. Let's talk about negotiation 101. Darren A. Smith: Oh, negotiation 101, okay. Now, recently I wrote an article in The Grocer, name-drop, about negotiation. And a couple of people wrote to me on LinkedIn and said it was very good. It was about me selling my wife's Beetle. And short story, the guy, we took it out for a spin and he said to me, while he was driving the Beetle, he said, "You know I want to negotiate." I said, "Yeah, brilliant." And we came back here, this is my house. And we're looking around the car, as two men do, and I know nothing about cars. We're kicking the tires. And he said, "Right, I'm ready to negotiate." And I said, "Cool." And I pushed the price up by 250 quid. And he said, "No, no, no, we were going to negotiate." I said, "I am." Andrew Grant: A little bit cheeky, a little bit cheeky. I'd suggest if you're a small supplier to a Tesco, you don't do that. But fair enough. I think in the world of cars, there are no rules. Andrew Grant: But no, I was reading an article in one of the Sunday papers about the Brexit deal. And they were saying that the deal was only done because the EU convinced themselves that Boris was mad enough to go through with a no-deal. So effectively, that Boris was willing to cut his nose off to spite his face. And it was only because they were convinced he was willing to do something almost illogical that they came to the party. And it just got me thinking about, I always remember being told, taught, "Never threaten something you're not willing to carry through." Darren A. Smith: Absolutely, yeah. Andrew Grant: Because if you get called out on it, that is your credibility gone forever and a day. Darren A. Smith: Well, and that's it. And you've lost the negotiation, but not only that, you've lost the relationship long-term. Because every time you ever bluff in the future, they'll say, "Yeah, we'll call it." Yeah, I'd agree. Andrew Grant: Yeah, and I think that's probably the critical thing when it comes to supermarket negotiations, hopefully, they're not just one-offs. You selling your wife's car is a one-off, clearly, you didn't mind if you upset the other guy. Andrew Grant: Yeah, hopefully, you'll never see him again. But yeah, if you're hoping to have a long and fruitful supply relationship with a supermarket, you really do need to get into that win-win zone. Into a lose-win, or even... Yeah, win for the supplier, lose for the supermarket, probably not a good long-term option. Darren A. Smith: No, no. And there's Steven Covey, in his 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, talks about in the habit win-win. A great story, where it goes through win-win, or win-lose, or lose-win. And he talks about the long-term effects of that. Because lots of people talk about win-win, but actually what they're sort of thinking is win-die, "I'm going to take as much as I can, and the rest can go poke it." But Covey puts it really, really well. So I'm going to recommend the audio version of that habit. Andrew Grant: Okay, yeah. Because yes, I think you're right. I

Grocery Sales Christmas 2020: Who Are the Winners and the Turkeys? Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the eleventh episode of Grocery Guru: Are there any Christmas Turkey Leftovers? It's that time of the year where we get to reflect upon the results of the Christmas 2020 trading period. Who were the winners and who were the turkeys when we take a look at the Christmas grocery sales 2020? You Can Read the Full Grocery Sales Christmas 2020 Episode Transcript Below:   Darren A. Smith: Welcome to, this is week 11 of the Grocery Guru, with Andrew Grant. Andrew, how are you? Andrew Grant: Yes. Happy New Year, Darren. Season's greetings. Darren A. Smith: Yes. Thank you. How was your Christmas? Andrew Grant: Yeah, very good. Very good. I can't remember what part of lockdown we were in, but yeah, it was a pretty good Christmas, despite. Darren A. Smith: Yes. Then we had the announcement on Monday. But, let's ignore that, move on straight onto grocery stuff. So, I believe the title of the episode you've given us this week is, Are There Any Christmas Turkey Leftovers? Which has intrigued me, because I know nothing about what we're going to talk about this week. Andrew Grant: Okay. Christmas turkeys left over, maybe was the full title. Darren A. Smith: Ah, that one. Andrew Grant: No. It's that time of the year where obviously, you get to see who were the winners and the turkeys over Christmas. So the latest Kantar data came out, I think on Tuesday or maybe Wednesday. Tuesday, I think. So here we go, Darren. Which multiple do you think was the best performing over Christmas, by a long chalk? Darren A. Smith: Really? Okay. Best multiple. And is this growth on growth? Andrew Grant: Sorry. Let's say the best grocer. Darren A. Smith: The best grocer, okay. Is this growth on growth, or best overall market share? Andrew Grant: No, no. This is market share. This is growth in the however many weeks up to Christmas. Darren A. Smith: Okay. All right. Andrew Grant: 12 weeks up to the 27th of December, the country's fastest-growing food retailer was? Darren A. Smith: I'm going to go Aldi. Now, I'm going to go, Aldi, because I think they were doing very well. We shopped in late December, or just before Christmas Day, and we found things like prawn rings, which were cracking value. Andrew Grant: Okay. Darren A. Smith: It was something like £3.80 for this prawn ring of 70 prawns. Andrew Grant: Okay. All right. So your answer is Aldi? Darren A. Smith: It is. Andrew Grant: I'll change the question then. Which was the worst-performing retailer over Christmas? Because it's the same answer, Darren. Darren A. Smith: Oh, is it? Andrew Grant: Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Aldi only showed 6% growth in a market that grew by 11.3. Darren A. Smith: Wow. Andrew Grant: I know. I was shocked for about five seconds, but there's a very obvious answer. Darren A. Smith: All right. So obvious that I don't know it. I can't even reach for it. So let me just understand. So they were five points of growth behind the average, Aldi? Andrew Grant: Behind the average. And when I tell you who the biggest, or when you guess who the biggest grower is, they were 30-odd points behind the biggest grower. Darren A. Smith: Okay. Andrew Grant: So what have we been talking about, quite a few of the last 10-odd episodes? What's been the biggest change in grocery this year because of the pandemic? Darren A. Smith: Okay. So we're talking about online shopping, I guess. Andrew Grant: Okay. And what haven't Aldi got? Darren A. Smith: Online shopping. Very good point, Andrew. Very good point. I think you've caught me out. Andrew Grant: Absolutely. So I think Aldi has really, really suffered. If you think the last three or four years we've expected to see double-digit growth from the likes of Aldi and

2021 Predictions Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the tenth episode of Grocery Guru: Good Riddance 2020! Our Predictions for 2021... You Can Read the Full 2021 Predictions Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to episode 10, with the Grocery Guru that is Andrew Grant. How are you? Andrew Grant: Hello Darren. Yes, Merry Christmas. Darren A. Smith: Merry Christmas to you. We're the 17th December, not long until the big one, until the big, fat man comes. Andrew Grant: Yeah. One week, one week, six nights, seven nights, something like that. Yeah. Darren A. Smith: Seven nights. All right. In this episode we said that we would talk about predictions for '21, trying to put 2020 behind us with a big boo and a mask. Andrew Grant: Yeah. No. Absolutely. I mean, obviously, it's been a pretty horrible year... everybody around the planet. We won't be doing this again until it is 2021. So yeah, farewell 2020, won't be missed. What's 2021 going to look like? I've been thinking of a few things that may or may not happen. I don't know about you if you have any predictions? Darren A. Smith: Well, I've got a few predictions, so I'm going to share my first one with you. I've got a few and I'm sure you have too. I'm going to predict that the title of the national account manager is going to be wiped. What I mean by that is national account managers traditionally looked after the account, looked after the buyer, did the negotiations. I think they're all going to be turning into shopper insights managers, insights managers, category managers. I think it's going to go. Andrew Grant: And NAM becomes a SIM. Darren A. Smith: And NAM becomes a SIM, yes. Andrew Grant: I think we talked about that last week, didn't we? Absolutely. I think you said that any national account manager that's been [inaudible 00:03:19] months and maybe is slightly worried about his or her future, the future gets on top of the data. Become an expert at turning that data into insight so that you can sit on Zoom with your supermarket buyers and show them that you know their shoppers better than they do. Darren A. Smith: Like it, like it. All right. That's my first prediction, call me Nostradamus. What's yours? Andrew Grant: Mine, I think this is a very, very safe bet of £10 of your money, Darren. I know you don't like spending your money on bets. But Amazon gets added to GSCOP, so the Grocery Code Adjudicator makes Amazon the 14th, I think I would be right, the 14th retailer to be covered by the code. With all this COVID stuff Amazon's business has just skyrocketed this year, and possibly almost under the radar. But I think 2021 will be the year when the new adjudicator goes, "This is a massive, massive food business now." We're also going to have the first Amazon ghost stores, the checkout-less, completely checkout-less electronic stores. They'll probably open first quarter. And probably just the publicity [inaudible 00:04:39] publicity over those will raise the awareness. So yeah, Amazon to be added to GSCOP. Darren A. Smith: Okay. All right. I think you're right, to make 14. So that will be Mark White, the new GCA Groceries Code Adjudicator. Andrew Grant: Yeah. If you're him you're just coming into that fabled first 100 days, what's the thing that you can say you've done in your first 100 days? Darren A. Smith: Very true. Very true. All right. All right. My prediction- Andrew Grant: I think that's a good headline. Darren A. Smith: Sorry, go on. A good headline? Andrew Grant: No, a good 100-day headline for him is, "Yeah, I've added Amazon to the list of covered retailers." Darren A. Smith: Very true. Very true. All right. So currently 39% of us buy our groceries online. So that's 39%, so let's call it 40%, 4 out of 10 of us are buying groceries online. I'm going to make an easy prediction, 2021 that's going to topple above 50, which means one in two people are buying their groceries online. Andrew Grant: I can see th

The Three Ghosts of Christmas Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the eighth episode of Grocery Guru: The Three Ghosts of Christmas; Past, Present and Future. You Can Read The Full Three Ghosts of Christmas Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Hello. Welcome to episode nine of the Grocery Guru. We're here with Andrew Grant. Andrew Grant: Hi, Darren. Darren A. Smith: Hello. You're looking very festive with your Christmas tree. Andrew Grant: Yes, look. Yeah. All nice and ready. Not a lot of presents under the tree. A bit worried. It must be these port delays that we're hearing about. Darren A. Smith: It must be. Now one of my favourite films is the Christmas Scrooge Muppet Carol with Michael Caine. Andrew Grant: Yeah. Michael Caine. Darren A. Smith: Now I've said that because I've set you up in the... I don't know, you want to talk about the three ghosts, is that right? Andrew Grant: Yeah. No, the Christmas Carol. Yes. Charles Dickens, the Ghosts of Christmas Past, Present and Future. They visited Scrooge on Christmas Eve and yeah, I think this is really aimed at, I guess, at account managers, because obviously, the Ghost of Christmas Past, both you and I as buyers used to see, I don't know, what 20 account managers a week? Darren A. Smith: Yeah, yeah. Or more. Yeah, yeah. The whole variety. Yeah. Andrew Grant: They'd spend their day driving down the M1, they'd turn up with that Greggs sausage roll pastry on their suit. They'd have a nice half-hour chat with us. We might even give them a cup of coffee. And then they're off to have a sleep in the lay-by for the afternoon. Darren A. Smith: They were all hardworking as well. Andrew Grant: I'm sure they were all very hardworking but unfortunately, the fact of Christmas present is, I'm not sure there'll be a single account manager out there that has actually had a physical meeting with a buyer this year. And we've said in a couple of these episodes, haven't we, that the last nine months has compressed 10 years' worth of change to everything. To all our lives, but, just as much grocer, I think we said it with home shopping, home deliveries and now at the stage where they were expected to be in 2030, not in 2020. Darren A. Smith: And wasn't it the CEO of Airbnb that said something like 18 years of development has been crushed in nine months. Andrew Grant: Yeah. This nine months has changed our lives at warp speed. And just thinking of the account manager, nine months without a physical meeting with a buyer, lucky probably even to get Zoom meetings. Darren A. Smith: Yes. Andrew Grant: So the future, looking forward to the Ghost of Christmas Future is, and not wanting to be too bleak about it, but I think buyers have become a lot more self-sufficient, a lot less needy of their account managers in the last nine months. And I don't see that changing. Darren A. Smith: Well, that's very true. And also I'm just going to touch on the Ghost of Christmas Past a little more, in that those account managers, some of them are excellent at their interpersonal skills, building relationships and that's all flipped on its head where they're now trying to do it over Zoom, which is much, much harder. Andrew Grant: Darren, remind us of your Zoom statistic. Why is Zoom so difficult? Darren A. Smith: Well, Zoom's difficult because the eye can see 576 million pixels. Now that just means we're in higher resolutions. When I see you face to face, you're in high resolution, I can see all the corners of your mouth changing, your eyebrows raised, all those nonverbal cues that could be an idea of what you're doing or what you're really saying. But over here, my laptop's running about a million pixels, maybe a million and a half. So it's like watching someone through a fog. I can't see all the little changes that you're making that give me the idea of what you really mean. And that's hard and it's exhausting. And that's why the Ghost of Christmas Past, sorry, Presen

The Future of High Street Join Andrew Grant and Darren A. Smith in the eighth episode of Grocery Guru: The Future of High Street. You Can Read the Full Future of High Street Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: ... keeping their staff safe, understanding the rules, blah, blah, blah. You're right. They've done it. Do you say they were cajoled into doing this? Andrew Grant: Who knows. Who knows the discussions I had. I think the important thing is that it's been done and I guess that's sort of the breaking news. So it almost links to what I was going to talk about today, which is they're also having to, as we've said in a couple of the previous episodes of this, they're having to deal with change to their market where 10 years of change has happened in six months. [crosstalk 00:00:00:38]. Darren A. Smith: Yeah, yeah. Andrew Grant: Yeah. And the costs involved in just coping with that must be immense. Darren A. Smith: And what does that mean? I mean, we've got the future of the High Street. I'm sure that's well documented. And particularly we've got Debenhams, Arcadia recent. The future of our High Street, I mean, is it all going to be coffee shops and hairdressers? Andrew Grant: Well, it's interesting. I think, unfortunately, you get the pain before the game. I saw over the weekend, Bill Grimsby, Bill Grimsey, I don't even remember him, used to run Iceland and then Wix. Seasoned retail professional. Got a lot of time for the guys. A really good operator. I think he interviewed me once but didn't give me the job. So anyway, not everyone's perfect. But he basically was saying that people like himself spent the eighties and the nineties creating Lego brick towns where you can remember every single town was a copycat. There was a Boots, a WHSmiths. Also a Tesco. There was a Curry's, there was a God going back, Timothy Wise, Radio Rentals, and every town was a carbon copy. Darren A. Smith: And I remember as a kid and then becoming an adult, you, you went from towns being very different. You've visited towns as a kid and you saw different things. And then as an adult, we went to towns and it was exactly the same damn thing in every town. But now that's going to go completely off. Andrew Grant: That is the opportunity that supermarkets, as we said, they will be different. They're not going to have deli counters. As we said, I think last week or the week before, these urban fulfilment centres where half of the store turns dark and the new Lego brick is online. So online is increasing, how do you differentiate online because you can offer everything online? So people love the convenience of online. They love the convenience of the van turning up outside the house, but it's not exactly exciting, is it? Darren A. Smith: No, it's not. I mean, one of the things that have happened is speed. You can now get something in about five hours of ordering it off some website. Andrew Grant: Yeah. Darren A. Smith: Some in 12 hours, 24. The days of taking 3 to 5 business days are gone. So that [inaudible 00:03:05]. Andrew Grant: People want to touch and feel. They want to touch, feel, smell, experience stuff before they buy it. Particularly, maybe not necessarily food but certainly think of clothes. So how many times do you buy clothes and they don't fit or they're not quite what you expected. People will still want shops. Darren A. Smith: The returns policy comes in and it has to be absolutely open. Free delivery, free try on, send back whatever you don't want I'll put the money in your account before it arrives to us. Andrew Grant: Which is where Amazon, whether you love them or don't love them, absolutely brilliant. But anyway, I've got a quiz for you. I've got a quiz for you, Darren. So future of the High Street, there has been research done in terms of what will encourage people into stores if there aren't any deli counters, the grocery becomes part of the dark store, what sort of services and things do people w

Discussing the Deli Counter Demise We all love them, buy a treat from them occasionally, but have they had their day? Are we witnessing the demise of the deli counter? Is it time to put them out to pasture? You Can Read the Full Deli Counter Demise Episode Transcript Below: Darren A. Smith: Welcome to week five with the Grocery Guru, there is Andrew Grant. Andrew, how are you doing? Andrew Grant: Yeah. Good morning. I think it's still good morning, Darren. But suffice to say I'm in mourning. Darren A. Smith: You are in mourning. Andrew Grant: See what I did there? See what I did there? Darren A. Smith: I see that was a good double pun. I understand you're in mourning because of some news about some counters. Is that right? Andrew Grant: Yeah. Sainsbury's closing all their meat, fish, and deli counters, which was ground zero for me as a fresh face graduate buying fish for Sainsbury's fish counters. So a little bit of history ending for me so hence the small little tear of regret. Darren A. Smith: So the retail landscape, the high street is changing, counters are going for one of the big supermarkets. But interestingly, I also read that Waitrose has taken advantage of this and put more lines, extended their range on their counters. Andrew Grant: Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? I've got a sneaking suspicion that a person with a calculator and a red pen made the decision to close those counters. If you dial into their half-year results presentation to the city, they said they'll save 60 million by closing the counters. Now their underlying profits are really 300 million, so that's a good 20% of profits that will get boosted when they close them. So I think it's very much been a financial decision. Darren A. Smith: And I'm not surprised by that. Now, did you know that MBM used to have a sister business called MCM? Andrew Grant: Well, I do remember you used to be in the counter business because the other point I was going to make it all right, you're going to save 60 million in operating costs. But what do you do with all that metal and perspex and refrigeration and yeah, it's an expensive kit. Darren A. Smith: So we used to be very big into counters. At one point for four years, we coached all the food counter people at Sainsbury's and then made a great market share difference for them. They then took it in-house and we took the idea to Tesco, had a team of 60 people coaching all the people behind counters. So I know a bit about it. Now what one of the Tesco's guys said at the time, was the counters was the window to fresh. And if shoppers saw counters looking good and feeling good and it was intangible, they said that was something we need to keep. Because it keeps shoppers coming in, even though they didn't buy from it. Andrew Grant: Well, I think that was unfortunately the reality. Having spent a bit of time on fresh fish and deli, unfortunately, yeah, it's poor Mrs. Miggins or Mr. Miggins shuffling along to buy six slices of crumbed ham for their lunches. So the only stuff that ever sold was the basic stuff, your pork pies and your breaded ham and cheddar cheese, which obviously you can also get in pre-pack. So the only people who tended to buy on the deli counters were people wanting tiny, tiny portions. And yeah, I can remember doing it myself trying to launch exotic stuff, exotic hams, and exotic sausages and God knows what. It just didn't sell and then after about six weeks, you get all the store managers and area managers complaining about waste. So you took the easy decision. I think it's a real shame. Darren A. Smith: It is. It is a shame. Unfortunately, I see counters and always did, a bit like a turkey at Christmas. I wouldn't have a Christmas without one but I don't necessarily think about it first. Andrew Grant: Yeah. Yeah. It is going to be interesting to see whether the decision will come and bite Sainsbury's in the bum. Because