So you wanna learn Japanese, huh? It's a daunting task, but one David McNeill of Expat Empire tackled quite effectively. If you're looking for language learning resources specifically for Japanese, this episode of Alone with Peter is chalk full of them. On season 2, episode 19 of Alone with Peter David McNeill of Expat Empire talks about his journey towards mastering the Japanese language, how he moved to Japan, and some of the struggles he encountered living in a foreign culture as an expat. Listen on Apple Listen on Spotify Listen on Stitcher Listen on Podchaser Listen on Apple Listen on Spotify Listen on Stitcher Listen on Podchaser Enjoying the show? Follow us on Instagram! Be sure to follow Alone with Peter on Instagram for highlight clips of the latest episodes, previews of upcoming guests, and more. Follow along, and send me a DM to let me know what you think of the show! David McNeill Founder of Expat Empire If you want to get in touch with David McNeill or learn more about what Expat Empire has to offer your move abroad check out the links below. Website: https://expatempire.com Podcast: https://expatempire.com/podcast-overview/ Facebook: https://facebook.com/expatempire Instagram: https://instagram.com/expatempire LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/expatempire/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/ExpatEmpire Japanese Language Resources Mentioned in this episode Here are some Japanese resources mentioned in the podcast episode. Happy language learning! Genki - https://genki.japantimes.co.jp/index_en Japanese Pod 101 - https://www.japanesepod101.com/ Anki - https://apps.ankiweb.net/ A Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar - https://www.amazon.com/Dictionary-Basic-Japanese-Grammar/dp/4789004546 A Dictionary of Intermediate Japanese Grammar - https://www.amazon.com/Dictionary-Intermediate-Japanese-Grammar/dp/4789007758 A Dictionary of Advanced Japanese Grammar - https://www.amazon.com/Dictionary-Advanced-Japanese-Grammar-English/dp/4789012956 Please enjoy part 2 of our interview with David McNeill, Founder of Expat Empire *Transcripts may contain a few typos. With interviews ranging from 1-2 hours, it can be difficult to catch minor errors. Peter Kersting: Welcome to Alone with Peter, a podcast for entrepreneurs, artists, digital nomads, and people seeking personal growth. We're back for part two of our interview with David McNeil, the founder of Expat Empire. What is Expat Empire? Well, you'll have to stay tuned to find out. Peter Kersting: Right now. We're talking with David about Japan because surprise, surprise. David is fluent in Japanese, and if you looking at him, you would never guess it because he is the wightest Mofo I've ever seen he's from the Bay Area, fluent in Japanese. So tell me about that. How did that get started for you because obviously in the previous episode, if you wanna hear about it, you guys go back. David has family who have had interesting ties to Japan and it's kind of sparked an interest for you, but how did the study of the language start? That is a whole other ball of yarn. David McNeill: Yeah, absolutely. I got interested as we talked about through, honestly at least on a personal level, obviously there was the, there was the, you know, family elements and things like that that were always in the background, but also just getting into the Japanese culture through the anime, the manga, the video games, the stuff that's been popular over the years. And at least for me, the gateway, the entry was, Dragonball Z which I think was popular for a lot of kids of my generation. And I think what it was though was that I saw it and I was like, this is so cool. And I love this, but then it also was me in the back of my mind thinking, you know, it'd be really way cooler would be to watch this without subtitles or to watch it in Japanese. David McNeill: I guess I was watching it in English at the time. Of course. And I think that just was one of the things that sparked the interest. There were a few other things like, I, I don't know, it was just something in the back of my mind and I kept, it's one of those things where if you have it in the back of your mind, you keep seeing it pop up here and there. And it just kind of grew into something that I was actually kind of interested in pursuing. David McNeill: It was around those years where at least my dad was like, you should get a hobby, you should like develop a skill on something. And I was like, yeah, that's a good idea. , sure, dad. I tried, you know, playing music and I couldn't really stick with that. And I've tried sports over the years and I mean, I did stick with some of those over a couple years, but it just wasn't my passion. David McNeill: And so I was like, okay, language. And I was just never that drawn to learning Spanish or French or German, like most, you know, a lot of kids do in school, in the us. And anyway, Japanese was kind of sitting there in the background. And, um, my mom was working also on the side for a book selling company at the time. And there was a discount, uh, some promotion going on for the sellers. And I looked through there and I'm like, oh, a Japanese book and cassette tape set. That sounds pretty good. Get me that. And then it took a couple months and a couple tries for me to stick with it. But then it became a thing where every day, honestly, every day for 30 minutes a day, I sat down and did it. And then I did that every single day at 12 years old, Peter Kersting: Every day for 30 minutes a day. Hang on before you keep going, because we're gonna talk about this for a second here. Okay. I'm sure the listeners may know, but if they don't Japanese, at least for a native English speaker is probably one of the most challenging languages you picked one of the hardest ones you could do because there's three different alphabets, right? It's character based. There's not, it's definitely not. It's definitely not Roman stuff and the pronunciation and everything else is gonna be as foreign to you as possible. Did you realize how much you were getting yourself into when you chose Japanese? David McNeill: So not no, no. I just thought it would be cool. Peter Kersting: Does anyone ever, David McNeill: I think, I think it's one of those things that maybe if you have the, the perspective, if you're, I don't know if you've learned languages before or you're older and have more demands on your time, then maybe there's that point where you're like, oh, you know what? I don't know if I just, I don't know if I want to go down this path and I'm glad that I did, but it was one of those things where, I mean, again, I was truly, truly passionate about it and I did not think, of course, I thought, well, it's different from Spanish and it would be easier just to take that at school. But I think passion, at least for me, has always played a big part in this and keep sticking with something and wanting to do it. So I think with Japanese, I had that and I didn't have the context of, well, this is one of the hardest languages to learn. David McNeill: I mean, there was a point where after you learn the first two basic, um, writing more, more basic writing systems with around 50 characters each, where you go into the, the congy, the Chinese, uh, originally Chinese characters and there's for fluency, you need at least basically to learn, at least 2000 of them is what they say. There was that point where I was like, do I really want to learn congy or not? Because that is such a huge investment and a huge, you know, thing to embark on. And I thought about it for a while. Honestly, I was on the fence, but it came down to, well, if I'm really serious about this language, the only way to keep improving, the only way to get fluent really is to learn at least how to read the congy. So then once that was done and you learn your first couple, then it's just years and years of effort after that. Peter Kersting: Okay. Hold up though, by the timing that you got to Kanji, how long had you been invested? David McNeill: Um, well, so I started, uh, it's hard. I'm trying to think exactly when that was, but probably, you know, I started when I was 12 and I did that booking cassette tape set a few times. I did a school at the community college, uh, did a class at the community college. And then I started taking after school, um, lessons up there in Los Angeles. And probably then that was when I was around. I don't know, 14 or so, so probably 14, 15. I decided, okay. I mean, if I, if I'm gonna keep going, then I need to do this. It's kind of that thing. I mean, especially at least in a Japanese school, if I was just doing it all on my own, maybe, you know, you'd find a way around it some, some way, if you just wanted spoken fluency, but if you wanna study it properly in, in after school classes or in language programs or in university, then you have to do it. So it's just kind of that decision. Peter Kersting: This is something I know a lot of people are gonna be interested in because if you're interested in living in Japan, it really, really helps to know the language. And as you kind of hinted at right now, it's not something you can exactly pick up overnight. So I want to touch on a couple things and I would love for you to elaborate. Okay. First of all, I love that you said you have to have passion because I think that is key for any long term goal, right? If you don't have passion for it, if you don't have a end game reason for it, you're not gonna learn. Also, you said you spent 30 minutes a day every day for how long? David McNeill: Um, well I think probably the way to put it is I'm sure I did many more than this over the years, but there's that thing about learning something for 10,000 hours to become a master at it. And I don't know if it, I there's, there are these kind of numbers of hours that it would take to become fluent in a language that's done by some government agency. And I'm sure it's off of the, you know, it's not 10,000 or something, whatever they say, but, um, maybe if you do it in the most efficient way or things like that, it could be less. But I really, uh, you know, it was 30 minutes a day for nine months with that course. And th