Debbi Mack interviews crime fiction author David Swinson. To buy any of the books displayed, just click on the cover. The interview transcript is below, if you’d like to read it. Or download the PDF copy and read it later. Debbi: Hi! This is the Crime Cafe, your podcasting source of great crime, suspense and thriller writing. Before I introduce our guest, I’d like to remind you to check out the Crime Cafe story collections; a boxed set and a short story anthology. They’re on my website, debbimack.com. Just click on the link “Crime Cafe” and you can get to the buy buttons there, as well as see our merchandise and other stuff that’s cool, and subscribe buttons, of course, to the podcast. Also, get ready for our Patreon launch. I’m setting up an online community for supporters of the Crime Cafe and there will be great perks for anybody who contributes and exclusive content if you contribute at a certain level. It’s not a very high level, either. So, it’s monthly contributions and I would greatly appreciate your support for that. When that comes out, I’ll let you know. In any case, without further ado, I would like to introduce my distinguished guest… David: Oh geez! Debbi: A really great author who writes wonderful crime fiction, David Swinson. David: Hi! Debbi: Hi, David. How’s it going? David: Good, good. Debbi: Excellent. I met you online after reading, The Second Girl. I found a review, I can’t remember where it was, but somewhere or other a review popped up for, The Second Girl and I was just captivated by it. Not only because it’s set in D.C., which is, you know, I live near D.C., arguably Columbia is a suburb of D.C. David: Fairfax Station. Debbi: Yeah, but it was just such a wonderful story with a great protagonist. David: Thank you. Debbi: Now reading Crime Song, which is a stunning and wonderful follow up. It’s excellent and I would like you to tell us more about Frank Marr and the series and how and why you developed this character. David: Well, Frank Marr … I think The Second Girl was published in May of 2016 and then Crime Song, June of 2017 and then the third book is not coming out until February 2019. But prior to 2016, I mean Frank Marr was in my head seriously for years, I mean a long time. And I had written a couple of other books prior to The Second Girl and they got rejected and they were police procedurals and then I went back to Frank and said, listen I’m just going to have fun. I’m going to do something that’s so outside of me, and Frank Marr is totally outside of me. I mean, in certain ways I’d love to be like him. In certain ways I would not want to be like him at all. But nothing bothers him or affects him, I mean as far as like his habit and stuff like that. It’s like he’s almost blind to that kind of stuff. But I just sat down and had fun and wrote it, and when I gave it to my agent with the other two books I had written, she goes, “Are you sure you’re done?” You know? And that’s sort of like an indication, well, maybe I better go…but on this one she didn’t say that. She just said, this is good and she did not send it out wide, she only sent…I wanted her to send it to an editor who had turned me down like two times, Josh Kendall at Little Brown in Mulholland and he ended up falling in love with it. But Frank…before Frank was a retired cop turned PI, he was an actual burglar. Not a cop, just a regular burglar that got involved in some PI work. But he was also a burglar and that’s what, you know got him his money and stuff like that. But Frank Marr, he ended up changing and I made him a retired cop turned PI. It also used to take place in 1999, because that’s really when MS-13 was really active with trying to recruit young girls and stuff like that in high schools and I agreed with my editor. I mean 1999…I wanted to really get away from all the social media, because I can’t stand having to write about that stuff.